Good news for False Bay

[strandwolf]

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

Moenie julle hoop op die stop van treknet plaas nie. Die sogenaamde wetenskaplikes is al so baie keer verkeerd bewys dat as hulle name genoem word dan lag ons al. Kyk na die onlangse geskiedenis en maak julle oe oop . As daar toegemaak word sal heel eerste alle recreationals gestop word. BV. perlemoen en amper daar kreef. Nog 'n foutjie van die gesiene wetenskaplikkes daar is tans 7 nette in die baai nie 2 nie. Snaaks hulle moan nie oor hulle belange in die treknette saam IJ nie.

Hi Andre

We haven't heard from the ANC fishing desk for a while.

I was wondering if you had all been singing "Kill the Boer" so much that you had forgotten to come onto Sealine. ::wlkcmb

Most of us have been following the 500 ton or so overcatch on the interim relief kreef. What is sad is that the kreef overcatch has resulted in a huge knock on recreationals.

It does not help to take swipes at scientists. If you say that they are wrong then it means that there is more uncertainty and management should be even more conservative.

We've only count one net at Klein vishoek. So 5 rights holders and 1 interim relief site.

Macassar - 1

Muizenberg to Strandfontein - 2

Fish Hoek to Smits -  2

Interim relief at Klein Vishoek- 1 (Includng Achmat, Albertyn and Cotton)

What nets are we missing?

As i said we do not worry about the ANC FD and we are not members of them. we have 2 nets for klein vishoek not 1. Why would we be singing kill the boer as our organizations are multi racial with a common goal. Your statement of 500 ton overcatch is and cannot be proven, as our total harvest recorded never crossed the 270 ton mark. I work with facts not stories and gossip. Do you know the tonnage recreationals poached this season? Again i state that if the scientist confirms their "not knowing" in meetings, then i have the right to openly state the fact.

 

[jb2]

strandwolf wrote:

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

As i said we do not worry about the ANC FD and we are not members of them. we have 2 nets for klein vishoek not 1. Why would we be singing kill the boer as our organizations are multi racial with a common goal. Your statement of 500 ton overcatch is and cannot be proven, as our total harvest recorded never crossed the 270 ton mark. I work with facts not stories and gossip. Do you know the tonnage recreationals poached this season? Again i state that if the scientist confirms their "not knowing" in meetings, then i have the right to openly state the fact.

Hi Strandwolf

When did you leave the ANC fishing Desk and where are you now.

The overcatch was calculated from exports and not the landing tallies.

Most people have been pretty open about the overcatch and ackowledge it as a concern.

 

[strandwolf]

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

Moenie julle hoop op die stop van treknet plaas nie. Die sogenaamde wetenskaplikes is al so baie keer verkeerd bewys dat as hulle name genoem word dan lag ons al. Kyk na die onlangse geskiedenis en maak julle oe oop . As daar toegemaak word sal heel eerste alle recreationals gestop word. BV. perlemoen en amper daar kreef. Nog 'n foutjie van die gesiene wetenskaplikkes daar is tans 7 nette in die baai nie 2 nie. Snaaks hulle moan nie oor hulle belange in die treknette saam IJ nie.

Hi Meneer V D Merwe

Please get back to us so we know that you have not been harmed during a rousing rendition of "Dubul Ibunu - Kill the Boer" at the ANC fishing desk meetings.

How many nets do you count?

 

plse get your facts straight, then comment. when you were opressing the minorities we were fishing to earn a livelihood.

 

[strandwolf]

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

As i said we do not worry about the ANC FD and we are not members of them. we have 2 nets for klein vishoek not 1. Why would we be singing kill the boer as our organizations are multi racial with a common goal. Your statement of 500 ton overcatch is and cannot be proven, as our total harvest recorded never crossed the 270 ton mark. I work with facts not stories and gossip. Do you know the tonnage recreationals poached this season? Again i state that if the scientist confirms their "not knowing" in meetings, then i have the right to openly state the fact.

Hi Strandwolf

When did you leave the ANC fishing Desk and where are you now.

The overcatch was calculated from exports and not the landing tallies.

Most people have been pretty open about the overcatch and ackowledge it as a concern.

i never was a member of ANC FD as the ANC FD always tried to jump on the wagon after we did the hard work. I am at home. The overcatch as you said was calculated from EXPORTS and not LANDED tallies. So how stupid can you be?? Why dont you mention that we did not EXPORT our catches, but the BUYERS DID. How can you now blame us for BIG BUSSINESS exporting illegal lobster. Another thing that seems most of the members of sealine is afraid off. why not be open but hide behind usernames. I aint afraid as i can prove every thing i state.

 

[jb2]

strandwolf wrote:

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

As i said we do not worry about the ANC FD and we are not members of them. we have 2 nets for klein vishoek not 1. Why would we be singing kill the boer as our organizations are multi racial with a common goal. Your statement of 500 ton overcatch is and cannot be proven, as our total harvest recorded never crossed the 270 ton mark. I work with facts not stories and gossip. Do you know the tonnage recreationals poached this season? Again i state that if the scientist confirms their "not knowing" in meetings, then i have the right to openly state the fact.

Hi Strandwolf

When did you leave the ANC fishing Desk and where are you now.

The overcatch was calculated from exports and not the landing tallies.

Most people have been pretty open about the overcatch and ackowledge it as a concern.

i never was a member of ANC FD as the ANC FD always tried to jump on the wagon after we did the hard work. I am at home. The overcatch as you said was calculated from EXPORTS and not LANDED tallies. So how stupid can you be?? Why dont you mention that we did not EXPORT our catches, but the BUYERS DID. How can you now blame us for BIG BUSSINESS exporting illegal lobster. Another thing that seems most of the members of sealine is afraid off. why not be open but hide behind usernames. I aint afraid as i can prove every thing i state.

Hi Strandwolf

The calculation of the overcatch is quite simple. Section 18 rights have a set weight /mass that they are allowed to catch. Their catch has to go over a scale.

Interim relief is per unit kreef and so mass calculations don't apply.

In the mass controlled sector you can't export more than you landed. In interim relief fishing there is no initial mass to balance off against and is open to abuse.

As to anonymity, I don't want to comment on whether Davout deserved to be strangled or not and you probably had every reason to give him a hiding but it shows that this  is an industry where threats of harm are very common and sometimes carried out.

 

[strandwolf]

kraken wrote:

I always find it disturbing that so many view the scientific community with mistrust and contempt. This is especially so when it comes to fisheries science.

Bear in mind that South Africa has a very rich and deeply involved history when one looks at fisheries science. This history stretches way back to the late 19th century with such well respected men as Prof John Gilchrist and later on Dr Cecil von Bonde regarded as highly knowledgable and practical men who were actively involved in many aspects of marine research.

Then of course we also have the world renowned JLB Smith who was not only a scientest but a keen and skilled angler.

The current group of scientests and researchers are just as well respected and I find it nothing short of insulting that so little respect is given to these individuals.

There is a well established relationship between research and most commercial fishing operations. Where does so much of the data come from?

In 1989, I was part of a research team doing a study on the rock lobster biomass off Cape Point. The local fleet was used extensively as a means of getting the required data, and I spent many days onboard Hout Bay based crayfish vessels sampling and measuring thousands of rock lobster.

A staggering amount of data has been gathered through the years by Sea Fisheries(now MCM) both on their own vessels as well as those belonging to the various fishing companies as well as private operators.

In addition to this, many of the technical staff are very well connected to various branches of the industry.

If these fishery scientests are so inept as so many believe, then who the hell is regarded as qualified to conduct the required research?

I've had the honour of fishing commercially with some very successful skippers and have met many more. Oddly enough, they seem to have little to complain about when it comes to scientests and simply get on with their job and catch fish. I guess thats why they are so successful.......

 

 

 

As you say above and made our point clear to all.

1. you cannot count, measure fish at CapePoint and decide their is 10 tons in Elands bay.

2. you cannot count cob in a river in transkei and decide a ban must be placed on false bay cob.

3. look at the courtcases, when big bussiness uses the same scientists from DAFF and how fast their calculations gets adjusted, because they "are connected" to big bussiness.

4. fishing reports submitted is fraudelent as by 2 main reasons, one scared of loosing the right and second the worry that taxes be calculated on the fish income.

5. why dont the scientist work with the local fishers per area to gain local knowledge ie redsteenbras on Aghulas bank.

6. why do you think fish catch stats went down, and therefor the scientists asume no more fish, look into the history timeframes, then you will see the picture.

7. every recreational is shouting "stop treknets" why? why not stop and calculate the damage down by inshore trawlers. one boat in one week destroy more than any treknet can do in 1 year. but still you support them by purchasing their fish brands in shops.

 

[strandwolf]

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

As i said we do not worry about the ANC FD and we are not members of them. we have 2 nets for klein vishoek not 1. Why would we be singing kill the boer as our organizations are multi racial with a common goal. Your statement of 500 ton overcatch is and cannot be proven, as our total harvest recorded never crossed the 270 ton mark. I work with facts not stories and gossip. Do you know the tonnage recreationals poached this season? Again i state that if the scientist confirms their "not knowing" in meetings, then i have the right to openly state the fact.

Hi Strandwolf

When did you leave the ANC fishing Desk and where are you now.

The overcatch was calculated from exports and not the landing tallies.

Most people have been pretty open about the overcatch and ackowledge it as a concern.

i never was a member of ANC FD as the ANC FD always tried to jump on the wagon after we did the hard work. I am at home. The overcatch as you said was calculated from EXPORTS and not LANDED tallies. So how stupid can you be?? Why dont you mention that we did not EXPORT our catches, but the BUYERS DID. How can you now blame us for BIG BUSSINESS exporting illegal lobster. Another thing that seems most of the members of sealine is afraid off. why not be open but hide behind usernames. I aint afraid as i can prove every thing i state.

Hi Strandwolf

The calculation of the overcatch is quite simple. Section 18 rights have a set weight /mass that they are allowed to catch. Their catch has to go over a scale.

Interim relief is per unit kreef and so mass calculations don't apply.

In the mass controlled sector you can't export more than you landed. In interim relief fishing there is no initial mass to balance off against and is open to abuse.

As to anonymity, I don't want to comment on whether Davout deserved to be strangled or not and you probably had every reason to give him a hiding but it shows that this  is an industry where threats of harm are very common and sometimes carried out.

See again you are misinformed, our catches was unit based but had to go over the scales. the weight and number of fish is clearly stated and co-signed by the local FCO. Only this slip can be used to export the fish. If the companies make copies and export more , we are not to blame. every fisher have his/her own record book and this book is kept by the landing monitor, so no overcatch could be made or fraudelent slips issued as it had to be signed by 2 parties.

 

[BTTB]

jb2 wrote:

BTTB wrote:

Please refer to the thread Save False Bay as reference as I notice there are several similar threads and most of the debate hinges only around the trekkers.

With the official Save False Bay thread in place I would simply like to point out that in the interests of False Bay as a whole we must not make this a trekker vs the rest scenario as that is only one aspect of the problems encountered in False Bay.

Hi BTTB

Thanks for that but the appeal of targetting the trekkers is that it provides the potential for a quick fix to a complex problem.

Why should I wory about water abstraction in the Eastern Cape and the closure of estuary mouths when I can look at two people.

People don't want complex solutions to complex problems.

If there was a quick fix then all the better. What is your suggestion with a LT solution in mind?

Several concerns are MCM's lack of resources and determination to resolve the problems. Mooting something until it gets done is one thing, but come next season the same problem will resurface with undersized fish.

What may likely happen is the ban will come into place when the season is quiet or over and actually be meaningless other than paperwork for MCM.
MCM staff will relax as they have the public and media off their backs and life will carry on, until the next time.

My other concern is for this to be the trekkers vs the rest scenario as at the end of the day they are human beings trying to make a living and believe you me they will deliver that story to the media if they cannot fish for their living. The media will have a field day, lots of posturing will go back and forth from all parties, but nothing will be resolved.

In the Save False Bay thread the long term goal should be to rid the bay of all trekking forever when the rights expire, but if this is to be achieved in the short term these fishermen will have to be compensated with alternative fisheries or other means to make a living. Personally I sympathise with the trekkers, but maybe they can get off their behinds and wet a line like the rest of the commercial fishermen. Have we not had the best Snoek season in living memory, what was wrong with these fisherman, maybe some too old perhaps, but at the end of the day they would have done far better.

 

[Marthin]

Strandwolf I'm sorry sir I find it very difficult to accept conservation advice from someone who's himself been accused and I think convicted of grossly transgressing conservational laws and catch limits.

 

[jb2]

strandwolf wrote:

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

i never was a member of ANC FD as the ANC FD always tried to jump on the wagon after we did the hard work. I am at home. The overcatch as you said was calculated from EXPORTS and not LANDED tallies. So how stupid can you be?? Why dont you mention that we did not EXPORT our catches, but the BUYERS DID. How can you now blame us for BIG BUSSINESS exporting illegal lobster. Another thing that seems most of the members of sealine is afraid off. why not be open but hide behind usernames. I aint afraid as i can prove every thing i state.

Hi Strandwolf

The calculation of the overcatch is quite simple. Section 18 rights have a set weight /mass that they are allowed to catch. Their catch has to go over a scale.

Interim relief is per unit kreef and so mass calculations don't apply.

In the mass controlled sector you can't export more than you landed. In interim relief fishing there is no initial mass to balance off against and is open to abuse.

As to anonymity, I don't want to comment on whether Davout deserved to be strangled or not and you probably had every reason to give him a hiding but it shows that this  is an industry where threats of harm are very common and sometimes carried out.

See again you are misinformed, our catches was unit based but had to go over the scales. the weight and number of fish is clearly stated and co-signed by the local FCO. Only this slip can be used to export the fish. If the companies make copies and export more , we are not to blame. every fisher have his/her own record book and this book is kept by the landing monitor, so no overcatch could be made or fraudelent slips issued as it had to be signed by 2 parties.

Hi Strandwolf

As you point out the catch is not mass based and is open ended. Not all fish was weighed and overcatch was staggering! Compliance was minimal.

The controls failed!

 

[Trophy]

[align=center]Yawn...![/align]
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[Elf 786]

Trophy wrote:

[align=center]Yawn...![/align]

[align=center]:blah:blah:blah:blah[/align]

ditto.....

 

[strandwolf]

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

i never was a member of ANC FD as the ANC FD always tried to jump on the wagon after we did the hard work. I am at home. The overcatch as you said was calculated from EXPORTS and not LANDED tallies. So how stupid can you be?? Why dont you mention that we did not EXPORT our catches, but the BUYERS DID. How can you now blame us for BIG BUSSINESS exporting illegal lobster. Another thing that seems most of the members of sealine is afraid off. why not be open but hide behind usernames. I aint afraid as i can prove every thing i state.

Hi Strandwolf

The calculation of the overcatch is quite simple. Section 18 rights have a set weight /mass that they are allowed to catch. Their catch has to go over a scale.

Interim relief is per unit kreef and so mass calculations don't apply.

In the mass controlled sector you can't export more than you landed. In interim relief fishing there is no initial mass to balance off against and is open to abuse.

As to anonymity, I don't want to comment on whether Davout deserved to be strangled or not and you probably had every reason to give him a hiding but it shows that this  is an industry where threats of harm are very common and sometimes carried out.

See again you are misinformed, our catches was unit based but had to go over the scales. the weight and number of fish is clearly stated and co-signed by the local FCO. Only this slip can be used to export the fish. If the companies make copies and export more , we are not to blame. every fisher have his/her own record book and this book is kept by the landing monitor, so no overcatch could be made or fraudelent slips issued as it had to be signed by 2 parties.

Hi Strandwolf

As you point out the catch is not mass based and is open ended. Not all fish was weighed and overcatch was staggering! Compliance was minimal.

The controls failed!

Surely you must be able to read, but again its your choice to believe whatever you want.

 

[strandwolf]

Marthin wrote:

Strandwolf I'm sorry sir I find it very difficult to accept conservation advice from someone who's himself been accused and I think convicted of grossly transgressing conservational laws and catch limits.

Marthin you give me 1 person who did not transgress the old or new seafishery act. Remember we fought the old and new goverment to get our rights back, yes we openly poached, we burnt boats and we pulled guns. Some of us were caught took the blame and others not. The fact of the matter was and still is today that government came and took our means of living, our tradition, our heritage away without consulting even. I have in my lifetime experienced nearly all types of south african fisheries via crew member, officer or skipper of said vessels. I was director of many fishing factories so I know what i am talking about. Currently I am president of Ocean Watch South Africa. As the saying goes it takes a poacher to catch a poacher.

 

[Angus]

strandwolf wrote:

Marthin wrote:

Strandwolf I'm sorry sir I find it very difficult to accept conservation advice from someone who's himself been accused and I think convicted of grossly transgressing conservational laws and catch limits.

Marthin you give me 1 person who did not transgress the old or new seafishery act. Remember we fought the old and new goverment to get our rights back, yes we openly poached, we burnt boats and we pulled guns. Some of us were caught took the blame and others not. The fact of the matter was and still is today that government came and took our means of living, our tradition, our heritage away without consulting even. I have in my lifetime experienced nearly all types of south african fisheries via crew member, officer or skipper of said vessels. I was director of many fishing factories so I know what i am talking about. Currently I am president of Ocean Watch South Africa. As the saying goes it takes a poacher to catch a poacher.

Who/what is Ocean Watch?......cannot seem to find any info on it via Google 

 

[marinello599]

strandwolf wrote:

Marthin wrote:

Strandwolf I'm sorry sir I find it very difficult to accept conservation advice from someone who's himself been accused and I think convicted of grossly transgressing conservational laws and catch limits.

Marthin you give me 1 person who did not transgress the old or new seafishery act. Remember we fought the old and new goverment to get our rights back, yes we openly poached, we burnt boats and we pulled guns. Some of us were caught took the blame and others not. The fact of the matter was and still is today that government came and took our means of living, our tradition, our heritage away without consulting even. I have in my lifetime experienced nearly all types of south african fisheries via crew member, officer or skipper of said vessels. I was director of many fishing factories so I know what i am talking about. Currently I am president of Ocean Watch South Africa. As the saying goes it takes a poacher to catch a poacher.

::cop:

 

[Marthin]

strandwolf wrote:

Marthin wrote:

Strandwolf I'm sorry sir I find it very difficult to accept conservation advice from someone who's himself been accused and I think convicted of grossly transgressing conservational laws and catch limits.

Marthin you give me 1 person who did not transgress the old or new seafishery act. Remember we fought the old and new goverment to get our rights back, yes we openly poached, we burnt boats and we pulled guns. Some of us were caught took the blame and others not. The fact of the matter was and still is today that government came and took our means of living, our tradition, our heritage away without consulting even. I have in my lifetime experienced nearly all types of south african fisheries via crew member, officer or skipper of said vessels. I was director of many fishing factories so I know what i am talking about. Currently I am president of Ocean Watch South Africa. As the saying goes it takes a poacher to catch a poacher.

Strandwolf tell u what. I'm not sure a leopard can change his spots, but let's give u the benefit of the doubt...

The first time I see you speak up about fishing and quotas purely from a what is best for the coast/ocean rather than speaking up for an individual/organisation/group about what slice of the ever shrinking cake they should get regardless of the impact, ull have my full support. Not that my one voice counts for much, but that's how I feel.

I said the same thing on the treknet and save false bay thread. I won't support the ban on trekking, if the majority of the people supporting the ban is doing so because they wanted to catch the 50 pounder in the net and make kerrievis!

For arguments sake let's take false bay, if the survival or improvement of the area is directly dependant on me stopping fishing there then so be it. I am yet to see you have that view. Trekkers scum that they are voluntarily stopped trekking till they have been given the go ahead by the clever people that the baby kob have moved off.

If ur opinion of the scientists are correct your solution is even more flawed. What commercial fisherman no matter how small the venture is going to tell the guys making the regulations that a species is under threat, and the fishery should be closed for a bit? Come now... What I've always thought the most fundamentaly flawed part of ur thinking is that the fish around cape point stay in cape point. Even if that is so, the offspring often moves very far from there. Crayfish larvae can be carried a very long way. So while the numbers can be very high in one spot, their high numbers are needed to keep other populations at surviveable levels.

If the coppers on augulhas banks were left in peace for 5 years, imagine catching them from the side again at arniston...

 

[jb2]

strandwolf wrote:

jb2 wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

Moenie julle hoop op die stop van treknet plaas nie. Die sogenaamde wetenskaplikes is al so baie keer verkeerd bewys dat as hulle name genoem word dan lag ons al. Kyk na die onlangse geskiedenis en maak julle oe oop . As daar toegemaak word sal heel eerste alle recreationals gestop word. BV. perlemoen en amper daar kreef. Nog 'n foutjie van die gesiene wetenskaplikkes daar is tans 7 nette in die baai nie 2 nie. Snaaks hulle moan nie oor hulle belange in die treknette saam IJ nie.

Hi Meneer V D Merwe

Please get back to us so we know that you have not been harmed during a rousing rendition of "Dubul Ibunu - Kill the Boer" at the ANC fishing desk meetings.

How many nets do you count?

 

plse get your facts straight, then comment. when you were opressing the minorities we were fishing to earn a livelihood.

Hi Strandwolf

I  am not sure that I have had a chance to get involved in any oppression. If there is any going around then please let me know. 

Here is your quote from  a while back:

"first if you throw politics in the fishing u get a f...up.
Cosatu is backing the cosatu fishing desk as the desk represent the whole industry. The buck does not stop by the fish that was caught but go back to the employment of the fish filleter and tackle shop assistant. All the years big bussinesses the likes of Lusitania Oceana IJ have pressured the government to get what they want threathning from no fish, retrenchments, bad weather, too much fish and a lot of other sh..t as long as it suits them. They run to court every year if talks fail and they dont get what they want. everyone thinks to bow before the high and mighty big bussiness, but do the maths and this we did. the contribution to SA from this big bussiness is f all compared to the other sectors in the industry even the recreational sector alone contribute more than them. This is one ofthe reasons Cosatu is backing the desk."

 

[strandwolf]

jb2

as you see in my previous post, cosatu fishing desk is not ANC only. All fishing sectors can use cosatu desk to help fight for the rights opressed upon. The ANC desk is something else only a couple of right holders using that name to gain influence, but boomeranged a lot already. We just heard apparantly FALSE Bay is closed for fishing from today. I cant get hold of any statement to that effect, as the newspaper who phoned me will try to forward this to me.

 

[strandwolf]

Marthin wrote:

strandwolf wrote:

Marthin wrote:

Strandwolf I'm sorry sir I find it very difficult to accept conservation advice from someone who's himself been accused and I think convicted of grossly transgressing conservational laws and catch limits.

Marthin you give me 1 person who did not transgress the old or new seafishery act. Remember we fought the old and new goverment to get our rights back, yes we openly poached, we burnt boats and we pulled guns. Some of us were caught took the blame and others not. The fact of the matter was and still is today that government came and took our means of living, our tradition, our heritage away without consulting even. I have in my lifetime experienced nearly all types of south african fisheries via crew member, officer or skipper of said vessels. I was director of many fishing factories so I know what i am talking about. Currently I am president of Ocean Watch South Africa. As the saying goes it takes a poacher to catch a poacher.

Strandwolf tell u what. I'm not sure a leopard can change his spots, but let's give u the benefit of the doubt...

The first time I see you speak up about fishing and quotas purely from a what is best for the coast/ocean rather than speaking up for an individual/organisation/group about what slice of the ever shrinking cake they should get regardless of the impact, ull have my full support. Not that my one voice counts for much, but that's how I feel.

I said the same thing on the treknet and save false bay thread. I won't support the ban on trekking, if the majority of the people supporting the ban is doing so because they wanted to catch the 50 pounder in the net and make kerrievis!

For arguments sake let's take false bay, if the survival or improvement of the area is directly dependant on me stopping fishing there then so be it. I am yet to see you have that view. Trekkers scum that they are voluntarily stopped trekking till they have been given the go ahead by the clever people that the baby kob have moved off.

If ur opinion of the scientists are correct your solution is even more flawed. What commercial fisherman no matter how small the venture is going to tell the guys making the regulations that a species is under threat, and the fishery should be closed for a bit? Come now... What I've always thought the most fundamentaly flawed part of ur thinking is that the fish around cape point stay in cape point. Even if that is so, the offspring often moves very far from there. Crayfish larvae can be carried a very long way. So while the numbers can be very high in one spot, their high numbers are needed to keep other populations at surviveable levels.

If the coppers on augulhas banks were left in peace for 5 years, imagine catching them from the side again at arniston...

marthin

we want the scientist to work with the local fishers, to consider their local knowledge, to take into account seasonal migrations as the locals know the areas. The current scientists believe that god sent them and they can decide sitting in a office what is what. look at the coppers on the banks, they go there out of season, water temp wrong, catch nothing so no fish. ask the locals what the current status is. there is so much you cant get a line to the sharks.