[b][size=4][i]The aliens have landed - BASS![/i][/

G

Guest

Guest
The aliens have landed - BASS!
Why are these fish a threat to our own?  Let’s compare what we know

  • The male guards the eggs in the nest he chooses in the gravel.  He will fan the gravel with his tail until all silt is removed and the gravel nest is clean enough for the female to deposit her eggs.  He will continue to guard the small larvae when they hatch.  He will fight off any predator.  Yellows leave the breeding grounds after laying their eggs.  The larvae are abandoned.

    [/*]

  • They mature after only one year]to reproduce.  Yellows mature at 5 - 8 years!!!!

    [/*]

  • They will eat almost anything - small snakes, other fish, lizards, small birds, any insect, frogs and even mice.  But here is the real bad news:  They will start hunting other fish when they themselves reach a body length of +]50mm!  That means they can get into all the hiding places of other juvenile species where larger fish cannot go.

    [/*]

  • He can swallow food one third his body size.

    [/*]

  • They can live for up to 12 years.

    [/*]

  • A very spiny dorsal fin will make any predator think twice before swallowing this fish.
[/*]
These are a few but very serious reasons why not to allow this fish into our water systems.  This fish originates from the United States but those in our water systems were introduced from the Netherlands in the 20’s.  This fish has two credits:  nice and easy to catch and good to eat, especially when prepared in a smoker.  So now we have a problem, how do we deal with it?

Fish for bass as much as you possibly can.  Get your rods out, get some lures / flies and catch as many as you want / can.  Do not release any bass again even if it is a lunker.  Take home and enjoy.  You will not wipe them out.  Bass have the reputation of being a great sport fish.  This statement is true but where do you draw the line?  Some angling tournaments in SA are built around this fish but the fact remains that it is responsible for the decline of some of our indigenous species.  Our largemouth yellow is struggling for survival in many instances even without any contact with the bass.  This has been established in the lower Vaal.  Dams can be classified as impoundments, very little water in, almost nothing out.  Here the competition between bass and yellow would be intense.  Every bass you can remove from this water is a bonus.  Don’t think you can ever wipe them out - that is impossible.


Source: 3 Provinces Environmental Newsletter
 
L

Little Green Fish

Sealiner
Jacques

Your point is taken, but you should then NOT Stop with Bass, Oh BTW they're actually not BASS AT ALL, they're members of the SUNFISH FAMILY.

Now You have an issue with Bass, and this topic has been discussed extensively in just about every medium available, so bottom line is this:

1. "Bass" is an alien species. SO IS TROUT AND YES CARP MY DEAR FRIEND.

2. If you want to get rid of "Bass" for your reasons of protecting indiginous species then remove the other alien species as well!  You cannot argue that trout and carp can stay but bass has to go, just because i.e. trout fishing is predominantly a richman's sport etc. and Carp, well they don't do anything wrong and they dont threaten our indiginous species. FACT: after the yellows leave their nests (BAD PARENTING AND NEEDS TO LEARN THE EVOLUTIONARY LESSON, SURVIVAL OF THE FITTEST, GUARD YOUR YOUNG OR GO EXTINCT, NOT MY RULES, NATURES) are very sly and hungry nest egg vacuum cleaners, one Carp can suck up all the eggs from several yellows nests in one day CAUSING MORE Damage to the Yellows than one BASS.

GET WITH THE PROGRAM, GET YOUR FACTS, THEN TAKE ACTION!

I WILL NOT KILL A "BASS", a TROUT, a CARP, a YELLOW or any other fish, just because I read some headline on some magazine saying eradicate the "The Aliens Have Landed"

One Last thing: TAKE NOTE: This is the year 2007, "BASS" was introduced to the RSA in the 1920's (YOUR FACT), "bass" couldn't destroy the indiginous species in the last, what 87 years, please my Friend, GET REAL!

LGF
 
L

Land Locked

Senior Member
LGF,

Trout n bass are at least edible and a lot of fun to catch, I vote we kill all the carp (Disgusting fish).
Locally bass are under presure from kurper, canary kurper if memory serves.

LL

ps. Have you ever targeted kurper on lure? Every bit as exciting as bass.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Chill Boet !

I'm for protecting the indigenous fish species. By the way catfish are also culprits in the declining yellowfish population. Our dams are overstocked with Carp and I catch trout for the pan. I never put back any bass.

I am an active member of the YWG (Yellow fish working group). This thread was posted to get some reaction (and in a way pole users of this forum's views). The thread had 20 views before anyone actuly said someting and your passion for your facet was confirmed when you replied (which I can't say for some of the others).
 
L

Little Green Fish

Sealiner
LL

Yeah, you know, Kurper are also predatory fish, like trout. What's worse is the fact the Yellows doesn't eat anything, they don't do nest robbing, etc. Oh and the Carps have acutally been witnessed hoovering "Bass" Nests clean..... FACT.

SO CATCH AND RELEASE IS THE WAY TO GO -FOR ALL SPECIES !!!!

LGF
 
L

Land Locked

Senior Member
Jaques,

I think what we are trying to say here is that bass are not nearly as big a threat as everybody makes out, they are the ultimate freshwater sport fish in terms of finding, hooking and fighting.

Yellows are awesome eating and fighting, but don't fight half as hard as a similar sized bass. Yellows are also endangered so my time is better spent chasing LGF's.

The cat fish you are refering to are probably barbel, an indiginous fish.

LL
 
G

Guest

Guest
Agreed LL,

I have caught many Bass in my fishing career - Yes they do give a nice fight, but not a fight that a 6kg Large Mouth Yellow gives you - my take (not a given).

Glad this thread got some reaction (44 views 3 participants). Catfish is indigenous, as you correctly mentioned - just wanted to make a point that the danger is not only the intruders but indigenous species as well.

It will be interesting to see what other forum mebers have to say on this subject as well.
 
J

jace

Senior Member
Hi guy

I think the reason many us viewed and not commented is that the majority of the members come from a Salty background....when I saw the post early this morning I was totally confused because most of the freshies battle to catch bass....so they were in a population growth to the detriment of the other species then the catch rates would be higher.

To join the discussion after hearing some input from the fresh water guys it does make sense to conserve this resource even if it is alien...as one the post illustrated in nature it is always survival of the fittest.

Rdgs

Jace
 
L

Little Green Fish

Sealiner
Jacques

I'm chilled Boet, but it's attitudes like your's and tunnel vision ideas like blaming one specie for the "problem" that can have adverse effects on what it is that YWG tries to achieve, i.e. What if you have cheesed me off this morning and I went and started breeding bass and let them loose where ever YWG is trying to reinstate Yellows?

I'm not saying that I'll do something that irresonsible, but what I'm saying is this:

1. If you really want to do something worth while, then start with getting FACTS.

2. DO PROPER RESEARCH of and on the FACTS COLLECTED!

3. Involve ALL the Concerned Groups, Gov, Sport, Nature Cons. ETC.

4. Then work out Strategies to rectify WHATever is Wrong in a manner that suits ALL.

Then you can close your eyes at night and say "I've done something good", But to kill one species bacause another is believed (NOT PROVED) to be threatened by that one specie and not taking all the factors i.e. pollution, other fish species (Carp a bigger threat to Yellows), catchment areas, urban development, rural development, the economy, etc. IS like I said A TUNNEL-VISION IDEA and yeah, VERY DANGEROUS in so many aspects.

Lastly: I WILL RELEASE, ALLWAYS !!!!

LGF
 
L

Loams

Sealiner
One thing can be said about the media.... They love sensationalism

Jacques, when quoting an article or newspaper clipping, you have to credit the source please.

Now, my take on this... the Yellowfish is under pressure yes, but it's mostly by man. You get man to stop taking trunkloads of fish home every weekend, and your problem will be solved, period! I fish in Mafikeng now and then, where there isn't a lot of pressure and no bootloads being carted off every weekend, and trust me the Carp, Bass, Yellows and Barbel populations are very healthy!

I don't like Bass in our natural streams and rivers either, but they are there... Nothing we can do anymore, other than catch and release.

I love fishing for Bass, in fact it's my passion, but they should be put into dams that do not get fed from rivers, or dams that are man made.... But there's a problem with that. Some Aquatic birds visit many dams and rivers in a day. They go to one dam, and perhaps stand on some eggs which get attached to their legs, they then fly to the next dam and these eggs come off, hatch and there it goes, exactly like bees pollinating flowers. So Bass will be in all our rivers, dams and streams at some stage, and there is no way to stop it.

It was a mistake to introduce Bass in SA in the first place, but believe me, they are here to stay, so we might as well make the best of it. Bass fishing in SA alone is a 60-80 million rand business. It also does a lot of good.

If you want to do any good, you should kill a couple of small Bass every now and then, as they are the ferocious buggers that eat like pigs. It will allow a higher survival rate of all the other fish, and the larger Bass in the dams will get even bigger.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Loams,

On the Spot  ! The same applies for Carp - specifically if you are a specimen carp angler. Get rid of the small ones and the big will get bigger.

Me bad - will edit the source in on first post. 
 
G

Guest

Guest
Minutes of the last conference held. The YWG has concluded a report based on a 10 year period. This report was released about a month ago and is huge (fits on CD) I will work through this if requred and post a summery:

This topic was discussed at the recent 10[suP]th[/suP] Annual Yellowfish Working Group Conference (YWG Conference) at Sterkfontein Dam outside Harrismith. These fish kills are an indicator of the serious pollution of our longest river and a warning of the threat to human life. Diarrhoea is the second largest cause of infant deaths worldwide. An outbreak of diarrhoea occurred in Bloemhof, North West Province on 19 February this year affecting 1000 people.

 

On Friday 7[suP]th[/suP] April a panel discussion at the conference was held including Dr Steve Mitchell of the Water Research Council, Riana Munnik of the Department of Water Affairs (DWAF), Dries Louw of East Rand Water (ERWAT), Francois van Wyk of Rand Water and Mornē Viljoen of Eco Care Trust.

 

Some of the statistics relating to the state of the Vaal were frightening and will appear in the Proceedings to be placed on the FOSAF website at www.fosaf.co.za by the mid June. In the meantime individual papers may be obtained by contacting the YWG secretary at mwardern@mweb.co.za.

 

The Saturday morning of the conference was dedicated to the state of the yellowfish in South Africa in the form of reports by the provincial nature conservation agencies.  There are nine distinct yellowfish species distributed throughout the country, each in their natural habitat. It should be noted that a species should never be moved outside its environment. Although these conservation bodies are doing sterling work it was alarming to note that virtually each report included examples of serious sewerage spills by municipalities and pollution by mines while major rivers cease to flow in the dry season due to excess water abstraction.

 

The afternoon session dealt with reports on scientific research being undertaken which includes design of fish ladders, genetic studies on the Orange-Vaal yellowfish, genetic evaluation on the smallscale yellowfish group and a telemetry study of the Vaal yellowfish using satellite tracking techniques.

 

Dean Impson of Cape Nature updated delegates on NEM:BA (National Environmental Management Biodiversity Act). The draft regulations being developed for alien species recommend that the main alien fish species; in other words trout, bass and carp, be permitted in defined zones but outside these zones stocking will not be allowed and anglers will be required to practice catch and kill. Fish specialists at the provincial conservation agencies are currently preparing beneficial use zones. Once these are competed, angling organisations will be consulted to allow final zoning maps to be produced.

 

The conference ended on the Sunday morning with a workshop on yellowfish river conservancies. The Orange-Vaal River Yellowfish Management Conservation Association controls 700 km of riverbank and represents some 70 riparian owners. This project is central to the YWG’s vision of river conservancies linking all landowners who will monitor the rivers and report any misdemeanour. Delegates also agreed that a ‘National State of the Yellowfish’ report was necessary and should be a focal area of activity in the year ahead.   

 

“ESTABLISHING A BENCHMARK” – CONFERENCE OPENING ADDRESS

 

It is now 10 years since our inaugural conference was held in 1996. It is pleasing to note that the YWG has been successful in initiating a healthy and rapidly expanding Yellowfish sport fishing industry. With value comes the necessity to protect, conserve and develop in a sustainable manner so that future generations may share this resource. This is a positive and predictable outcome.

 

The quest by the YWG for National Angling Regulations for Yellowfish has been interrupted by the development of regulations for NEM:BA, the listing of species and the zoning policy and process for all angling species. In all likelihood this process will be completed before the next conference. We appreciate the dialogue that Paul Skelton and Guy Preston have entered into with the Angling fraternity in this respect. Effective implementation of the regulations will require buy-in and commitment by riparian owners and anglers and will make a significant contribution to the protection of aquatic diversity. It will improve the quality of our angling in many instances.

 

“Certainty ? In this world nothing is certain but death and taxes” a famous quote by Benjiman Franklin. I would like to suggest that the most important thing we can be sure of in life is change. What is important is how we manage change. Even growing old is a process of change.

 

 In the last 10 years we have seen change and a rapid exodus of skilled and experienced people due to affirmative action. This is the reason for non-delivery in services in most instances. Government acknowledges this. The Deputy President recently launched the Accelerated and Shared Growth Initiative for South Africa (ASGISA) and Trevor Manuel has earmarked R3,75 billion for the project. If we are to see the planned growth of 6% per annum in the economy, we are going to need all the skilled people we can get (or keep) and it is at municipal level where the greatest needs lie. This will require a change in mindset from the highest political level to local managerial levels. I trust that this is going to work and put us back on the “high road”.

 

 We have many concerns with water quality in our dams and rivers, with the building of golf estates and other developments where there is an inadequate long term supply of water. We are concerned with developments that take the “short term cheap route” rather than a long term planning view, which may be more suitable and cost effective in the end.  We are concerned with minimum stream flow requirements and water transfer schemes where fish can be transferred between catchments. We are particularly concerned with the poor state of sewerage treatment which has manifested itself in fish kills on the Vaal River recently. This highlights the crisis we are facing and the high risks to human health.

 

Our keynote address will take the form of a short presentation by a panel of experts followed by group discussion, which will give us a better insight into the water affairs of the Vaal and an opportunity to discuss matters that concern us.Our conference theme this year is “Establishing a Benchmark”. Prominence has been given to the Provinces in their state of the Yellowfish report, which will create a benchmark against which we will report in the future. YWG Chapter reports will be delivered in the Provincial slot. This will be followed by presentations on new and existing research projects.

 

The Sunday workshop is on Yellowfish Conservancies, which has proved to be an essential tool in the conservation of yellowfish. YWG Management would like to see a lot more conservancies getting under way and the workshop will hopefully show the way forward in this respect.

 

Once again it is heartening to see the support that we have from over 300 correspondents and excellent support we have at our annual conferences.

 

Many thanks to the presenters and to YWG Exco members and especially to FOSAF who provide the secretariat and much of the funding. Also to Tembeka Dambuza from Anglo Gold Ashanti who funded most of the Genetic Study and to Dr Steve Mitchell of the WRC who is funding a number of our research projects.

 

I would like to welcome you all and especially our panellists for this evening’s event and to Thomas Du Toit of SAVE.

 

Bill Mincher

Chairman YWG  

7 April 2006

 
 
G

Guest

Guest
Could I please ask on eof the mods to move this topic to the Yellowfish section.

I have a brief of the YWG report and were to get it.
 
L

Land Locked

Senior Member
[color="#006600"]Jacques[/color] wrote:
The aliens have landed - BASS!
Why are these fish a threat to our own?  Let’s compare what we know

  • The male guards the eggs in the nest he chooses in the gravel.  He will fan the gravel with his tail until all silt is removed and the gravel nest is clean enough for the female to deposit her eggs.  He will continue to guard the small larvae when they hatch.  He will fight off any predator.  Yellows leave the breeding grounds after laying their eggs.  The larvae are abandoned.

    [/*]

  • They mature after only one year]to reproduce.  Yellows mature at 5 - 8 years!!!!

    [/*]

  • They will eat almost anything - small snakes, other fish, lizards, small birds, any insect, frogs and even mice.  But here is the real bad news:  They will start hunting other fish when they themselves reach a body length of +]50mm!  That means they can get into all the hiding places of other juvenile species where larger fish cannot go.

    [/*]

  • He can swallow food one third his body size.

    [/*]

  • They can live for up to 12 years.

    [/*]

  • A very spiny dorsal fin will make any predator think twice before swallowing this fish.
    [/*]
These are a few but very serious reasons why not to allow this fish into our water systems.  This fish originates from the United States but those in our water systems were introduced from the Netherlands in the 20’s.  This fish has two credits:  nice and easy to catch and good to eat, especially when prepared in a smoker.  So now we have a problem, how do we deal with it?

Fish for bass as much as you possibly can.  Get your rods out, get some lures / flies and catch as many as you want / can.  Do not release any bass again even if it is a lunker.  Take home and enjoy.  You will not wipe them out.  Bass have the reputation of being a great sport fish.  This statement is true but where do you draw the line?  Some angling tournaments in SA are built around this fish but the fact remains that it is responsible for the decline of some of our indigenous species.  Our largemouth yellow is struggling for survival in many instances even without any contact with the bass.  This has been established in the lower Vaal.  Dams can be classified as impoundments, very little water in, almost nothing out.  Here the competition between bass and yellow would be intense.  Every bass you can remove from this water is a bonus.  Don’t think you can ever wipe them out - that is impossible.


Source: 3 Provinces Environmental Newsletter
Click to expand...
This from the guy who releases BIG carp ?

Now I'm really confused.
 
L

Little Green Fish

Sealiner
LL

Just to confuse you even more and probs bring you to my level, please check out the Specimen Carp angling section and you'll see that 50% of the new topics in there has the same author, now you should be properly confused.....::craz

:f1shy
 
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