Jaco de Beer
New member
Can someone please assist me in tying a double line leader for deap sea fishing.
Thanx
Thanx
Doudle line leader
- Thread starter Jaco de Beer
- Start date
Try this link....
http://www.sealine.co.za/view_forum.php?id=44
Your best bet is a Bimini twist, but in thicker nylons 1mm+, it would be much easier to do a Spider Hitch. Not as strong, and not as much stretch as the Bimini, but it works... I think Hammertime uses the Spider Hitch - no??
http://www.sealine.co.za/view_forum.php?id=44
Your best bet is a Bimini twist, but in thicker nylons 1mm+, it would be much easier to do a Spider Hitch. Not as strong, and not as much stretch as the Bimini, but it works... I think Hammertime uses the Spider Hitch - no??
Hammertime
Sealiner
The best or second best actually is the bimini twist.
The first would have to be the Australian way of Plaiting a double (see Geoff Wilsos Fishing nots and rigs book & DVD). I CAN NOT get the plait right, never mind attempt it at sea.
Remember that the bimini and plait are actually progressive splices, not knots.
I used to Bimini everything but here's why I don't any more.
I believe in correct drag settings and I am talking for trolling here. I DON'T do star drags so I have control of those settings.
If you set your drag at 33% of lets say 10kg line. That means even if you get trigger happy and go past this and say fish 50% drag. 5kg. Your knots breaks at either 85% the Spider Hitch or 95-100% the bimini.
PLEASE THINK ABOUT WHAT I HAVE JUST WRITTEN.
Soooooo. If my drag is set properly and it is, then the spider is not going to be a problem. I have caught very big tuna on 10kg line after enduring hours of punishment from the fish and the Spider has always been there at the double, unbroken.
When I fish league I bimini all of the 12 rods we will take for the day. When one snaps, I will just spider hitch.
On 15kg I use the bimini and spider.
On 24kg and above I use the spider hitch.
But like I say I am a drag set fanatic.
BOTTOM Fishing - Braid
I have for many many years fished spiderwire on my KP's. Of late I have been using braid for my attempts at jigging.
With any form of braid because of the diameter you should bimini, no other knot for me is worth bothering about and the braid just takes the bimini so well.
I am not sure about doubling 1mm lines, I've never tried but I do do the spider hitch on 37kg main line and it's not the prettiest but again has never popped.
Hope this helps.
The how to for the spider and the bimini are on the site.
The first would have to be the Australian way of Plaiting a double (see Geoff Wilsos Fishing nots and rigs book & DVD). I CAN NOT get the plait right, never mind attempt it at sea.
Remember that the bimini and plait are actually progressive splices, not knots.
I used to Bimini everything but here's why I don't any more.
I believe in correct drag settings and I am talking for trolling here. I DON'T do star drags so I have control of those settings.
If you set your drag at 33% of lets say 10kg line. That means even if you get trigger happy and go past this and say fish 50% drag. 5kg. Your knots breaks at either 85% the Spider Hitch or 95-100% the bimini.
PLEASE THINK ABOUT WHAT I HAVE JUST WRITTEN.
Soooooo. If my drag is set properly and it is, then the spider is not going to be a problem. I have caught very big tuna on 10kg line after enduring hours of punishment from the fish and the Spider has always been there at the double, unbroken.
When I fish league I bimini all of the 12 rods we will take for the day. When one snaps, I will just spider hitch.
On 15kg I use the bimini and spider.
On 24kg and above I use the spider hitch.
But like I say I am a drag set fanatic.
BOTTOM Fishing - Braid
I have for many many years fished spiderwire on my KP's. Of late I have been using braid for my attempts at jigging.
With any form of braid because of the diameter you should bimini, no other knot for me is worth bothering about and the braid just takes the bimini so well.
I am not sure about doubling 1mm lines, I've never tried but I do do the spider hitch on 37kg main line and it's not the prettiest but again has never popped.
Hope this helps.
The how to for the spider and the bimini are on the site.
Fishaholic
Member
Hi,
I just want to know something else on double lines. I'm new to deepsea fishing and only have a 15 KG trolling setup. I used a albright knot to tie my mainline to the flouro leader, as a rookie. (before I found this site) It worked fine the first trip, I caught a sailie and dorrado like this, but on my second trip the knot parted twice when entering the rod eye, loosing two nice dorados.
I since learned a lot on this site, thanks a lot! It seems that a bimini or spider knot is best for double line and then a fig 8 or yucatan for 15KG trolling.
I'm just wondering, What is the purpose of the double line? Do you guys always use a double line on mono and up to what size. (Braid is another story) It seems that on the bigger lines its not used any more.
Thanx
I just want to know something else on double lines. I'm new to deepsea fishing and only have a 15 KG trolling setup. I used a albright knot to tie my mainline to the flouro leader, as a rookie. (before I found this site) It worked fine the first trip, I caught a sailie and dorrado like this, but on my second trip the knot parted twice when entering the rod eye, loosing two nice dorados.
I since learned a lot on this site, thanks a lot! It seems that a bimini or spider knot is best for double line and then a fig 8 or yucatan for 15KG trolling.
I'm just wondering, What is the purpose of the double line? Do you guys always use a double line on mono and up to what size. (Braid is another story) It seems that on the bigger lines its not used any more.
Thanx
Hammertime
Sealiner
@ Fishaholic
The double line in my opinion is used for one reason. To bulk up the line so that you can go from 15kg (10 or 24) mainline to a lets say 45kg to a 100kg leader.
There is a simple rule of thumb in that you don't go up more than triple the line. So 15kg would take you to a leader of 45kg. I must admit I break this every time I fish 10kg as my standard leader is 45kg.
On 37kg line I do not believe you need to double. I go straight to 45 or 60kg. This is my opinion though.
I am not sure if you doubled before going to your leade when using the albright. But if you went from 15 kg to a 37-45kg leader without the doublem that for me is your weak link right there. You must double on lines of thinner diameter.
I hope that answers the doubles.
On to knots.
Right I am going to repeat myself here, sorry for anyone who has to go through this again, but it's worth a mention.
Before I tell my story, I am going to give you the point.
Different lines prefer different knots and that is a fact!
Until I went on a fishing trip with Miles from Sealine on Dr Fish I had NEVER broken a knot. I have had line jump off the top roller and slice itself off between the roller and the casing, I've been burnt off, had other big tuna swim into my 10kg line under pressure etc. BUT NEVER had I popped a knot.
Whe out with Miles one day and after watching ESA and reading about the figure eight knot I thought I would change from my Albright and give this "bullet proof knot" a try.
I use Samurai Red as most know or Ande.
But social it's Samurai 37kg and 24kg. I don't double on the 37 as I've said. So I tied the 37kg to my 45kg Sportex leader with a figure eight and then and abright on my 45kg leader to my 1 meter 45kg Suffix Fluerocarbon bite trace.
Please see this link for setups.
http://www.sealine.co.za/view_topic.php?id=9130&forum_id=45
Just scroll down it's in there.
I put one line out and zzzzzz off. Ok I pushed the drag to 17kg but it popped.
17kg is nothing new for me. Pig tails on the red Samurai = broken knot.
Retied the same setup and zzzzzz off. Pig tails.
Thought bugger this, retie using the good old albright and the rest is history. Fish gutted and gilled.
From this I worked out that Samurai does NOT LIKE that figure eight. It may well have held on a stiffer less supple line.
Now onto the albright.
This may sound simple, but you need to wrap the thinner line around the thicker. I've seen it done the other way round and it just pops.
If you have two 24kg pieces of line say a 24kg sportex leader to a 24kg fluero bite trace. Make sure you wrap the softer sportex around the harder fluero.
This holds true for all the line. You would wrap the braid around the 24kg sportex right...
So it would be no different for the mono.
Watch the number of wraps on the albright. 7 wraps on 45kg line is way overkill. 4-5 is more than enough and less friction on the pull tight.
Pulling tight!
Pull the hell out of that albright, making sure you have put plenty gob on there before you pull it up. It is one knot that makes huge friction burns on the line.
I hook the line to a cleat and often use those fancy palagic leader gloves Nepptune gave me to make sure it's tight. I often, because of the gloves snap that knot.
WHY SO TIGHT. Right, this allows you to trim the tabs very small. On my rods I leave the softer lighter line tag a little longer. This will always be the tag that enters the guides on the way onto the reel. This tag will not get stuck if it is a little longer and WILL GET stuck if it is middle of the road. Ie not too long and not ultra short. Because there is a length, depending on the thickness that makes it far to stiff and it sticks.
The tag end leaving the rod is your thicker line. This guy is easy to control. Cut him very short after pulling the knot very tight. BUT here's the key. Cut the line at 45°. It makes a sharp point and I have found streamlines the knot.
Ok all very wordy and almost over technical, but when you are going from 10kg to 45kg and that leader goes on and off the rod a number of times in a 2-4 hour battle, then yeah you work on every little week link you can in the hope of achieving perfection.
I am fussy about my tackle prep and would consider some of my knots a bloody work of art.
I do not use the figure eight as a result of those two pops as they are the only two in my long off shore history. Based on the few simple observations mentioned above I have the utmost of faith in the albright knot.
I must add I have had a few interesting moments on braid, but I have only been using braid on game fish since June last year. I have used spiderwire on my bottom rigs, but there's been no 4 hour plus battles for me on those rigs and everything has held, plus I've always used heavy line.
The 10kg braid I have had to learn new ways of doing the bimini by adding lots of half hitches etc. I use the albright from the 10kg to my 27kg leaders for inshore and they have held firm except for one which I even said on the boat I had tiied badly.
Result = 1 free yellowtail with a snake spinner in him.
Hope that helps.
The double line in my opinion is used for one reason. To bulk up the line so that you can go from 15kg (10 or 24) mainline to a lets say 45kg to a 100kg leader.
There is a simple rule of thumb in that you don't go up more than triple the line. So 15kg would take you to a leader of 45kg. I must admit I break this every time I fish 10kg as my standard leader is 45kg.
On 37kg line I do not believe you need to double. I go straight to 45 or 60kg. This is my opinion though.
I am not sure if you doubled before going to your leade when using the albright. But if you went from 15 kg to a 37-45kg leader without the doublem that for me is your weak link right there. You must double on lines of thinner diameter.
I hope that answers the doubles.
On to knots.
Right I am going to repeat myself here, sorry for anyone who has to go through this again, but it's worth a mention.
Before I tell my story, I am going to give you the point.
Different lines prefer different knots and that is a fact!
Until I went on a fishing trip with Miles from Sealine on Dr Fish I had NEVER broken a knot. I have had line jump off the top roller and slice itself off between the roller and the casing, I've been burnt off, had other big tuna swim into my 10kg line under pressure etc. BUT NEVER had I popped a knot.
Whe out with Miles one day and after watching ESA and reading about the figure eight knot I thought I would change from my Albright and give this "bullet proof knot" a try.
I use Samurai Red as most know or Ande.
But social it's Samurai 37kg and 24kg. I don't double on the 37 as I've said. So I tied the 37kg to my 45kg Sportex leader with a figure eight and then and abright on my 45kg leader to my 1 meter 45kg Suffix Fluerocarbon bite trace.
Please see this link for setups.
http://www.sealine.co.za/view_topic.php?id=9130&forum_id=45
Just scroll down it's in there.
I put one line out and zzzzzz off. Ok I pushed the drag to 17kg but it popped.
17kg is nothing new for me. Pig tails on the red Samurai = broken knot.
Retied the same setup and zzzzzz off. Pig tails.
Thought bugger this, retie using the good old albright and the rest is history. Fish gutted and gilled.
From this I worked out that Samurai does NOT LIKE that figure eight. It may well have held on a stiffer less supple line.
Now onto the albright.
This may sound simple, but you need to wrap the thinner line around the thicker. I've seen it done the other way round and it just pops.
If you have two 24kg pieces of line say a 24kg sportex leader to a 24kg fluero bite trace. Make sure you wrap the softer sportex around the harder fluero.
This holds true for all the line. You would wrap the braid around the 24kg sportex right...
So it would be no different for the mono.
Watch the number of wraps on the albright. 7 wraps on 45kg line is way overkill. 4-5 is more than enough and less friction on the pull tight.
Pulling tight!
Pull the hell out of that albright, making sure you have put plenty gob on there before you pull it up. It is one knot that makes huge friction burns on the line.
I hook the line to a cleat and often use those fancy palagic leader gloves Nepptune gave me to make sure it's tight. I often, because of the gloves snap that knot.
WHY SO TIGHT. Right, this allows you to trim the tabs very small. On my rods I leave the softer lighter line tag a little longer. This will always be the tag that enters the guides on the way onto the reel. This tag will not get stuck if it is a little longer and WILL GET stuck if it is middle of the road. Ie not too long and not ultra short. Because there is a length, depending on the thickness that makes it far to stiff and it sticks.
The tag end leaving the rod is your thicker line. This guy is easy to control. Cut him very short after pulling the knot very tight. BUT here's the key. Cut the line at 45°. It makes a sharp point and I have found streamlines the knot.
Ok all very wordy and almost over technical, but when you are going from 10kg to 45kg and that leader goes on and off the rod a number of times in a 2-4 hour battle, then yeah you work on every little week link you can in the hope of achieving perfection.
I am fussy about my tackle prep and would consider some of my knots a bloody work of art.
I do not use the figure eight as a result of those two pops as they are the only two in my long off shore history. Based on the few simple observations mentioned above I have the utmost of faith in the albright knot.
I must add I have had a few interesting moments on braid, but I have only been using braid on game fish since June last year. I have used spiderwire on my bottom rigs, but there's been no 4 hour plus battles for me on those rigs and everything has held, plus I've always used heavy line.
The 10kg braid I have had to learn new ways of doing the bimini by adding lots of half hitches etc. I use the albright from the 10kg to my 27kg leaders for inshore and they have held firm except for one which I even said on the boat I had tiied badly.
Result = 1 free yellowtail with a snake spinner in him.
Hope that helps.
Fishaholic
Member
Thanks a lot HT!! will definately help. Won't loose the fish next time.