As the fighting continue between clubs and associa

[strandwolf]

As the fighting continue between clubs and associations both rock and surf and boat angling regarding who may catch and what. As recreational means you catch fish for personal consumption. point end.

If a recreational state this is his sport, then no problem is seen as this then falls under catch and release. If the regulation trouble the sport fisher the obtion to practice another sport is always there.

As the inspectors and MCM officials get confused with species, genera, sizes, gender and measurements, the new regulation will be fair and just.  Ready for it?

Every recreational angler (post office permit) will be allowed a bag limit of 10kg fish per day regardless specie etc. Total of 50kg in possesion(deepfreeze at home).

If the 1 fish you catch is more than the 10kg limit that is the end of your daily fishing and you can come the next day unless your 50kg at home is full.

if you catch tuna more than 50kg letter of skipper to that 1 fish will be allowed and only when that 1 fish has been consumed , you may go get another.

Now everbody is happy.

 

[FishFever]

Strandwolf,
Surely there must still be minimum size limits and bag limits. I personally saw guys caught 10 odd Galjoen between 20 and 30 cm and kept them. Their total weight won't reach 7 kg. That is absurd! Reef species would be driven to extinction

 

[strandwolf]

How do you say, better 1 die than 1000

 

[Whaler]

Is it the first of Aprill Today????

 

[drewmill]

i think it could work if they kept minimun bag and size limits, this then allows the guy to take a few grunter or shad home no problem but one garrick and klaar for the pot. i asume that this does not mean that he has to stop fishing only just that everything else has to be released. question if the fish is fought to death through exhaustion or is foul hooked would that mean the carcass is to be returned to the sea as the weight is exceeded i ask as this may be a way that unscrupulous anglers try to get passed the rule and take more than their alloted allowance home. I am interested in how this will be enforced and how will the competitions hold up to it, or will they be subject to different rules which will get really confusing for enforcement officers.

 

[strandwolf]

Competitions etc falls under SPORTS so catch and release, not happy go play tennis.

If your fish you catch and the last 1 go over your total catch of 10kg you stop fishing, should you have a line in water and your tally exceed 10kg you in trouble.

on your permit you will write the fish data as you catch them, so dont be caught lying.

 

[carcharias]

So because the inspectors are either too lasy or too stupid to learn the species, we have to suffer. This legislation, if passed, will have the exact opposite effect to the desired outcome. Everybody will just ignore it, just like the cellphone law.
The only answer is to have well trained, passionate staff doing the inspections. Not making laws that can and will never be policed.

 

[Walt]

Hi Strandwolf.Had some questions regarding implementation,but see this is still in proposal stage.I've heard of the Crayfish recreational guys in the past, going out 5 or 6 times a day,each time returning with regulated quotas,in case they're spotted  by inspectors.Has this been addressed?Cheers! 

 

[strandwolf]

Hi Walt
MCM is apparently going to do random house visits this season as per adress on PO permits, personally i think they will check those they see everday catching wcrl. Regarding the regulation there is validity as nobody i know can eat 10kg fish per day.

You have to sit down and make a couple of scenarios about the 10kg limit and 50kg possesion and the name recreational. Join the dots and see what you find. I would propose that the 10kg of fish stay but include a 10 fish count whichever is first reached. Hereby blocking 20 x 500g shad being caught etc.

 

[ChrisF]

[color=#006600]Walt[/color] wrote:

Hi Strandwolf.Had some questions regarding implementation,but see this is still in proposal stage.I've heard of the Crayfish recreational guys in the past, going out 5 or 6 times a day,each time returning with regulated quotas,in case they're spotted  by inspectors.Has this been addressed?Cheers! 

Hi Walt

 

For regulation purposes, the back of the licence has a table for quota caught, date etc.

As long as there is visible inspection, this will deter the '5 or 6 times a day' routine.

I've seen & heard this happen to often. Even though Abelone catching in banned. One still regularly hears of news reports or via the grapevine of people who catch them. Can't see how any of the MCM regulations applies, albeit that they do house-calls from time to time, will solve much. The presence is obviously required on the shores where it matters.

Whats gr8s my nerves are the guys who catch crayfish, then rip the tail from the torso while still alive. I was told on one particular outing...'they grow back'...some don't even bother tossing the torso back into the water....not that I believed that the tail would grow back as told anyway.

Just seems rather cruel. This is very evident as you cover the rocks at Pringle Bay for example.

I personally can't wait for November (spider season)

 

 

[strandwolf]

we have 200 new fco on the coastline this years season. i still say regarding the abalone to get the army with permanent roadblocks.

 

[Pylstert]

Ye right, they can hardly check what you catch on the beach now they are going to come to your house, how are they going to tell the difference between bait and fish you bought from Pick & PAy if they now apperently can't tell the difference between a mullet and a shad? Sounds like there's been a bit of sock smoking going on somewhere

 

[jb]

[color=#006600]strandwolf[/color] wrote:

As the fighting continue between clubs and associations both rock and surf and boat angling regarding who may catch and what. As recreational means you catch fish for personal consumption. point end.

If a recreational state this is his sport, then no problem is seen as this then falls under catch and release. If the regulation trouble the sport fisher the obtion to practice another sport is always there.

As the inspectors and MCM officials get confused with species, genera, sizes, gender and measurements, the new regulation will be fair and just.  Ready for it?

Every recreational angler (post office permit) will be allowed a bag limit of 10kg fish per day regardless specie etc. Total of 50kg in possesion(deepfreeze at home).

If the 1 fish you catch is more than the 10kg limit that is the end of your daily fishing and you can come the next day unless your 50kg at home is full.

if you catch tuna more than 50kg letter of skipper to that 1 fish will be allowed and only when that 1 fish has been consumed , you may go get another.

Now everbody is happy.

Hi Strandwolf. Who at MCM was suggesting this one. It sounds highly unlikely.

Please let us know if it was mentioned informally or was through some of the more formal meetings.

I know that there is a lot of pressure from the guys that you represent to cut down on the amount of fish that recreationals catch. I was just wondering if someone at MCM said this to keep your guys happy.

 

[strandwolf]

JB WROTE"I know that there is a lot of pressure from the guys that you represent to cut down on the amount of fish that recreationals catch. I was just wondering if someone at MCM said this to keep your guys happy."

Jb its this kind of blame shifting and stick throwing that laws are made who everyone object to , but too late. You dont know who or what I represent and what we stand for. If you knew you would not speak through your neck so much.
Seeing that you dont even know what your organization is doing is troublesome. Dont blame us. By the way we never accept anything from MCM unless its on paper and signed. Maybe a good tip to you.

As I said this is a proposal and i asked for inputs to this not shitty remarks but constructive solutions based on facts and not dreamedup science fiction. If you cant contribute be quiet.

 

[GL]

[color=#006600]strandwolf[/color] wrote:

Every recreational angler (post office permit) will be allowed a bag limit of 10kg fish per day regardless specie etc. Total of 50kg in possesion(deepfreeze at home).

If the 1 fish you catch is more than the 10kg limit that is the end of your daily fishing and you can come the next day unless your 50kg at home is full.

if you catch tuna more than 50kg letter of skipper to that 1 fish will be allowed and only when that 1 fish has been consumed , you may go get another.

Now everbody is happy.

Interesting . . . couple of questions:

1 What statistical data was used to arrive at 10kg / day and 50kg / home?

2 if i have 2 PO permits can i keep 20kg / day and 100kg / fridge cos the permit allows you to fish?

3 if i have 5 permits in my house with 5 family members and 250kg fish, how will MCM know who caught the fish . . . sort of defeats the object of restricting the "lucky" recreational guy who catches lots of fish that by intimation is being sold?

4 another clanger, if i have 1 permit and 50kg in freezer and 50 kg next to garbage bin, where do i stand? i.e. check the fine print

I do not envy you guys trying to come up with a workable solution.

If shad ban/restricted shad numbers has worked then is it not an option to introduce similar ban for all other species? I.E KISS principle probably better, workable solution?

 

 

[jb]

[color=#006600]strandwolf[/color] wrote:

JB WROTE"I know that there is a lot of pressure from the guys that you represent to cut down on the amount of fish that recreationals catch. I was just wondering if someone at MCM said this to keep your guys happy."

Jb its this kind of blame shifting and stick throwing that laws are made who everyone object to , but too late. You dont know who or what I represent and what we stand for. If you knew you would not speak through your neck so much.
Seeing that you dont even know what your organization is doing is troublesome. Dont blame us. By the way we never accept anything from MCM unless its on paper and signed. Maybe a good tip to you.

As I said this is a proposal and i asked for inputs to this not shitty remarks but constructive solutions based on facts and not dreamedup science fiction. If you cant contribute be quiet.

Hi Strandwolf.

I have had some contact with artisinal fishers and the theme of restricting recreationals has come up quite strongly.

Who made the proposal? Was it MCM? If so who at MCM made it?

If it was something that you are just throwing out there, then that's ok but just be clear about it.

There is nothing wrong with asking for comment. But you can't be selective.

I am obviously the first person to be sent to GULAG. Your friends at COSATU will recall the glorious regin of Joseph Stalin. His purges were designed to kill or isolate all those who asked difficult questions.

This included those with legal or engineering training.

Strandwolf. Please, pretty please, let us know what the origin of the proposal is

 

[strandwolf]

[color=#006600]GL[/color] wrote:

[color=#006600]strandwolf[/color] wrote:

Every recreational angler (post office permit) will be allowed a bag limit of 10kg fish per day regardless specie etc. Total of 50kg in possesion(deepfreeze at home).

If the 1 fish you catch is more than the 10kg limit that is the end of your daily fishing and you can come the next day unless your 50kg at home is full.

if you catch tuna more than 50kg letter of skipper to that 1 fish will be allowed and only when that 1 fish has been consumed , you may go get another.

Now everbody is happy.

Interesting . . . couple of questions:

1 What statistical data was used to arrive at 10kg / day and 50kg / home?Based on the fact if only the father figure per household is a angler, what could the family consume? To satisfy the angler without giving him/her a reason not to sell those catch.

2 if i have 2 PO permits can i keep 20kg / day and 100kg / fridge cos the permit allows you to fish?you as person are allowed 1 permit, but if a houshold have more anglers this is allowed as each member would have there own permit.

3 if i have 5 permits in my house with 5 family members and 250kg fish, how will MCM know who caught the fishevery catch to be reported at the back of permit as the fish was caught at the day, specie size etc. . . . sort of defeats the object of restricting the "lucky" recreational guy who catches lots of fish that by intimation is being sold?This is to stop recreationals selling fish as 40% of recreationals in the boating sector sells their catch.

4 another clanger, if i have 1 permit and 50kg in freezer and 50 kg next to garbage bin, where do i stand? i.e. check the fine printyour garbage bin your fine

I do not envy you guys trying to come up with a workable solution.input like yours is appreciated and i thank you for this

If shad ban/restricted shad numbers has worked the ban and restrictions was based on no factual science, also no fact exsist that it work or the stock have improved. how can a law be passed that shad may not be caught, sold, etc. in KZN but allowed in the rest of SA then is it not an option to introduce similar ban for all other species? total ban on abalone? since the ban 2000ton have been sold in Hong Kong all illegal SA abalone. I.E KISS principle probably better, workable solution?factual science not thumb sucking, working with recreationals, commercials etc solutions can be found to sustain the resources.

The human is designed to be curios, so if a law is passed they want to know why, what etc. So they break the law to find out. All of us is equal under the constitution so why protect one's interest above another.

 

 

[strandwolf]

[color=#006600]jb[/color] wrote:

[color=#006600]strandwolf[/color] wrote:

JB WROTE"I know that there is a lot of pressure from the guys that you represent to cut down on the amount of fish that recreationals catch. I was just wondering if someone at MCM said this to keep your guys happy."

Jb its this kind of blame shifting and stick throwing that laws are made who everyone object to , but too late. You dont know who or what I represent and what we stand for. If you knew you would not speak through your neck so much.
Seeing that you dont even know what your organization is doing is troublesome. Dont blame us. By the way we never accept anything from MCM unless its on paper and signed. Maybe a good tip to you.

As I said this is a proposal and i asked for inputs to this not shitty remarks but constructive solutions based on facts and not dreamedup science fiction. If you cant contribute be quiet.

Hi Strandwolf.

I have had some contact with artisinal fishers and the theme of restricting recreationals has come up quite strongly. I again strongly dissagree, as artisanal see all as equal before the law. The commercial sector yes as the recreational selling of their catches have a direct inpact on their income. eg when snoek is running prices fall because recreationals sell cheap to cover cost and the price paid per snoek is what the hawkers use to buy other fish as well.

Who made the proposal? Was it MCM? If so who at MCM made it?NEPAD discussions.

If it was something that you are just throwing out there, then that's ok but just be clear about it.as I said inputs with reasons is wanted, many brains is better than 1

There is nothing wrong with asking for comment. But you can't be selective. Iam not selective, as this impact is related directly to the recreational, I asked their input. Reason being that the recreational boating sector do not regard the shore recreational as their equal because of the expensis the boat have.

I am obviously the first person to be sent to GULAG. Your friends at COSATU will recall the glorious regin of Joseph Stalin. His purges were designed to kill or isolate all those who asked difficult questions. wake up apartheid is gone, freedom of speech is in. Stalin is dead.

This included those with legal or engineering training. ?if you refer to those who got fishing rights yes that rights will be revoked. no-one is stopping a lawyer etc of getting a PO permit and fish recreational.

Strandwolf. Please, pretty please, let us know what the origin of the proposal isalready answered. So plse jb, I would like real comments and facts and not refer to political discussions everytime.

 

[carcharias]

The problem with a proposal like this is:
How are you going to stop the "locals" who catch fish and sell them? Go down to the Transkei, you will find locals who catch undersise crayfish, by the dozen. These are either sold as bait or sold to tourists who have to have crays. Every inspector knows about the problem, yet nothing is ever done.

 

[GL]

[color=#006600]strandwolf[/color] wrote:

[color=#006600]GL[/color] wrote:

Interesting . . . couple of questions:

1 What statistical data was used to arrive at 10kg / day and 50kg / home?Based on the fact if only the father figure per household is a angler, what could the family consume? To satisfy the angler without giving him/her a reason not to sell those catch.

2 if i have 2 PO permits can i keep 20kg / day and 100kg / fridge cos the permit allows you to fish?you as person are allowed 1 permit, but if a houshold have more anglers this is allowed as each member would have there own permit.

3 if i have 5 permits in my house with 5 family members and 250kg fish, how will MCM know who caught the fishevery catch to be reported at the back of permit as the fish was caught at the day, specie size etc. . . . sort of defeats the object of restricting the "lucky" recreational guy who catches lots of fish that by intimation is being sold?This is to stop recreationals selling fish as 40% of recreationals in the boating sector sells their catch.

4 another clanger, if i have 1 permit and 50kg in freezer and 50 kg next to garbage bin, where do i stand? i.e. check the fine printyour garbage bin your fine

I do not envy you guys trying to come up with a workable solution.input like yours is appreciated and i thank you for this

If shad ban/restricted shad numbers has worked the ban and restrictions was based on no factual science, also no fact exsist that it work or the stock have improved. how can a law be passed that shad may not be caught, sold, etc. in KZN but allowed in the rest of SA then is it not an option to introduce similar ban for all other species? total ban on abalone? since the ban 2000ton have been sold in Hong Kong all illegal SA abalone. I.E KISS principle probably better, workable solution?factual science not thumb sucking, working with recreationals, commercials etc solutions can be found to sustain the resources.

 

 . . . so if there are 2 anglers in family we can have 100kg in freezer, i.e. we can double our consumption?

. . . i think proposal should look at end user/consumer i.e. don't do crime/buy stolen goods cos you are liable . . . same goes with buying fish from recreational fisherman.

. . . issue then is guys can give fish away

. . . repeal the shad ban as its does not work . . . abalone is different to fish and i don't even want to go there

. . . if issue is 40% of recreational boaters sell fish, how much are they selling . . . 1, 2, 5 10, 50, 100kgs . . . then its easier, confine quotas to recreationals based on how much they consume not assuming they can only eat 50 kg, restrict launch sites, launch times and make sure inspectors actually know what to do and are present daily to police it. This will create employement and make sure permit funds collected go to fishing community.

(Guys with boats this is not my scene but based on what i see on sealine, there is integrity in our forum's recreational boating community)

. . . noble intentions to save fishing waters for generations to come but it seems like there is serious lack of information available so its hard to debate what is needed, how it will be implemented, etc

i reckon its gonna be flippin easier to catch a 1000lb marlin on 30lb line than deal with this issue