do aliens exist?

hndray

Senior Member
http://www.space.com/31694-alien-life-extinct-fermi-paradox.html

By Mike Wall, Space.com Senior Writer | January 22, 2016 07:30am ET
If aliens are out there, they may all be dead.

It might be relatively easy for life to evolve on hospitable planets throughout the universe, but very hard for it to get any kind of a foothold, a new study suggests.
 
This could be the answer, the study's authors say, to the famous Fermi Paradox, which in its simplest form asks, "Where is everybody?" The universe is probably filled with habitable planets, so many scientists think it should be teeming with aliens," lead author Aditya Chopra, of the Australian National University (ANU) in Canberra, said in a statement. "Early life is fragile, so we believe it rarely evolves quickly enough to survive."

Chopra and co-author Charley Lineweaver, also of ANU, posit that environmental conditions on young planets are unstable, and there is thus likely only a small window of time for life to get going, even on initially hospitable worlds.

In the first 500 million years or so of a wet, rocky planet's life, for example, it will be too hot and heavily bombarded to support life. Life could emerge over the next 500 million years, as the planet cools and the impact rates settle down a bit.

During that time, however, the planet will probably be losing its liquid water, perhaps as the result of a runaway greenhouse effect (as occurred on Venus), or perhaps because it got too cold. There's a good chance that the planet will end up shifting from habitable to uninhabitable, as Venus and Mars apparently did, by roughly 1 billion to 1.5 billion years after its formation — unless life gets going fast enough to stabilize things, Chopra and Lineweaver say.

"Between the early heat pulses, freezing, volatile content variation, and runaway positive feedbacks, maintaining life on an initially wet rocky planet in the habitable zone may be like trying to ride a wild bull. Most life falls off," they write in the study, which was published in the journal Astrobiology. "Life may be rare in the universe, not because it is difficult to get started, but because habitable environments are difficult to maintain during the first billion years."

The researchers term this idea the "Gaian bottleneck" hypothesis. They contrast it with the "emergence bottleneck" concept, which postulates that it's tough for life to get started at all. (Good news: Earth life has made it over both of these putative hurdles.)

It's unclear, of course, which of these hypotheses better represents reality, or if either of them represents reality well at all. But there are possible (albeit difficult and time-consuming) ways to test such ideas out, the researchers said.

"One intriguing prediction of the Gaian bottleneck model is that the vast majority of fossils in the universe will be from extinct microbial life, not from multicellular species such as dinosaurs or humanoids that take billions of years to evolve," Lineweaver said in the same statement.
 

Psy

Sealiner
;)

How do you like these apples?

http://911planeshoax.com/2014/01/11/proof-that-no-real-planes-were-used-on-911/


::tight:

or this:


Now that technology allows us look even further, a team of researchers arranged the genome of a water bear species ‘Hypsibius dujardini’ to better comprehend how these animals can outstand the most extremes conditions. The results showed that this particular species of tardigrades, who can survive over 10 years without any food or water, has collected about 6,000 alien genes throughout its history through a process known as horizontal gene transfer, in which genetic material is acquired from other organisms instead of being hereditary transmitted from the parents. Most of the foreign genes come from bacteria, plants, fungi and Archaea.

http://www.ewao.com/a/21737/
 

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trevour wrote:
It's no surprise that religion is always discussed when the question is asked 'do aliens exist' or as it is normally asked 'do you BElIEVE in Aliens.' If this post asked does God exist, or do you BELIEVE in God, the conversation would have taken a similar path with long justifications, even claims of undeniable physical proof, and this on both rsides of the argument. BELIEVE or as religion would put it 'faith' or the lack there of, is the motivation for everyones point of view.

The only way faith becomes fact in an individuals life is personal encounters, or interaction. And for it to become a generally accepted fact, would require either NASA or similar proving they have found something, or if the aliens come to us, and by that I mean all of us in such a way that their is no debate. Religion would need something similar.

Until then everyone will have an opinion, and a justification for their opinion, but at the end of the day very few people will change their opinion or faith through being told by fellow humans that they are wrong.
Well said mate.. Ja Psy, those water bears are nuts.. Another alien on earth as far as I'm concerned is the toxoplasma gondii parasite..of which half of us are infected, infected rats want to get eaten by cats who are the hosts before us, it uses mind control and immune system control, running the balance of keeping the host alive to propagate more of its cysts and maybe getting it eaten to continue the life cycle..now that is a proper wierd one!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toxoplasmosis#Research

more..

Toxoplasma gondii infection reduces predator aversion in rats through epigenetic modulation in the host medial amygdalaAuthors
  • Shantala Arundhati Hari Dass,[/*]Ajai Vyas[/*]
AbstractMale rats (Rattus novergicus) infected with protozoan Toxoplasma gondii relinquish their innate aversion to the cat odours. This behavioural change is postulated to increase transmission of the parasite to its definitive felid hosts. Here, we show that the Toxoplasma gondii infection institutes an epigenetic change in the DNA methylation of the arginine vasopressin promoter in the medial amygdala of male rats. Infected animals exhibit hypomethylation of arginine vasopressin promoter, leading to greater expression of this nonapeptide. The infection also results in the greater activation of the vasopressinergic neurons after exposure to the cat odour. Furthermore, we show that loss of fear in the infected animals can be rescued by the systemic hypermethylation and recapitulated by directed hypomethylation in the medial amygdala. These results demonstrate an epigenetic proximate mechanism underlying the extended phenotype in the Rattus novergicus–Toxoplasma gondii association.


http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/mec.12888/abstract;jsessionid=B332AE6C653F1876D4FF9E1E98E099B0.f01t04?wol1URL=/doi/10.1111/mec.12888/abstract&regionCode=ZA&identityKey=1c36024b-0bfb-4059-8994-8af6d6ea863c
 

hndray

Senior Member
LET'S HEAR IT FOR THE FULLER FIGURE... LOL!
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/extraterrestrial-intelligent-life-likely-be-big-rather-small-says-study-1495123

Intelligent aliens, if they exist, are more likely to be huge with an average weight exceeding 300 kgs, says a study based on a mathematical model of probabilities.

University of Barcelona cosmologist Fergus Simpson based his conclusion on the assumption that organisms on other planets obey the same laws of conservation of energy as on Earth.

Preceding that assumption was the basic one that Earth-like planets are expected to provide the greatest opportunity for the detection of life beyond the Solar System.

Large animals use up more resources and expend more energy and thus are less abundant. This is why ants outnumber whales or elephants on Earth.

This in turn implies there are likely more small animals than large ones in the Universe, says Simpson. As planets with small animals outnumber those with large ones, it is most likely that Earth is one such planet with smaller intelligent beings.

He then used the model to arrive at a minimum size for intelligent life.

From the range of body sizes of animals on Earth he came up with the most probable distribution of organisms on other planets.

Other experts agree broadly on the average size calculation but note that many other factors like the planet's gravity could play a role in the body mass of inhabitants and push down a bit the sizes predicted.

Planets with a powerful gravitational pull may have more of smaller animals while a tiny planet with a weak pull could host bigger ones, Duncan Forgan, a scientist at the University of St Andrews School of Physics and Astronomy, told Newsweek.

Seth Shostak, from the SETI Institute, which leads the search for intelligent alien life, has suggested similar estimates in a work surmising that bigger animals live longer and longer lifespans are required to develop the kind of technology necessary for establishing contact with the outside world.

However, Shostak places both papers in the realm of speculation rather than evidence-based.

The work is limited, he says, in that it has only Earth to serve as a model for life.

He also points to how largeness cannot exactly be linked with intelligence, pointing to polar bears and the big animal's inability to "write great literature or build radio towers".

Shostak argues that opposable thumbs and upright stance have helped humans make it to the top of intelligent life on Earth, not body mass.

However, the study does concede that when looking at intelligent species out there, Earth cannot be considered a fair sample.

Any variable which influences either the population size or birth rate is susceptible to selection bias, it notes.

It takes a simple model where the mean population density does not vary with planet size.

Scientists have used data from NASA’s Kepler satellite to work out that billions of stars in the Milky Way will have one to three planets in the habitable zone. Kepler has so far found about 1,000 planets around the stars in the Milky Way, as well as about 3,000 potential planets.
 
Who knows? I think power and subsequently the money thing holds us back more than technology..Most really useful tech sits in a backroom long before it comes to market. Which leads us back to the main problem, we do have to rely on markets and things like that, we are firmly entrenched in a paradigm that comes from before us even and now we expect to move forwards dramatically, I don't think so. In an abundance driven rather than money driven economy the biggest issue is how to give stuff away to those who want it rather than how to profit more than your competitor, but that is a long way away, there are still way too many thieves and ignorant folk around and will be for a long time unless there is a great change for some or other reason. We would need a catalyst of great intellectual development and technology that would provide unprecedented abundance while not consuming limited resources and fossil fuels would have to become a thing of history too and energy would have to be free and unlimited. Great for all of us but not so great for those who really are in power in the world, those who have gotten used to be able to do whatever they like without care for ethic or morality. It is them and their demons that hold us back as a civilization, until we deal with the aliens inside of us like greed for example and get to understand the other ones like joy that live through us, only then can we move forward. But it is natural to resist change, even as I want to move towards an ideal and evolve, I only want to do it so far.. It will take way more than 100 years to get to type one, unless we are forced to by destroying our world and having the tech to save ourselves. Even something like fishing, it would take more than a hundred years for a pastime like this to die out, even if we killed all the fish in the sea, there would be a fresh hole somewhere with a scaly critter and someone would try to catch it, unless we destroyed the planet or ourselves. Why I meantion fishing is I wonder what a type1 would think of a "primitive" pastime like that, they would have abundance of which ever diet was required and it would most likely be produced in way that would involve no cruelty, that said they would have most likely forgotten about the joy of the hunt and the thrill of the fight and I'm not sure I would want to go there. I would prefer it to happen after my time as I am quite happily shamelessly enjoying the simple and honest earthly pleasures in the life I have been luckily given and would prefer to be reincarnated into a new world where there would be no memory of the simple pleasure of catching a fish. If it happened in my life that we were forced to give up this planet and go forth, I would be a fish out of water and be quite bleak for the rest of my days. And then what of the masses?

Who knows? haha?
 

Psy

Sealiner
evolution....psyche/ego needs to dissolve into one with the inner spirt, then we can travel with the stars

:)
 
The title of this thread should be changed to "Have Aliens visited earth" I think that's a better question.

That is a whole different question. Are they out there? Who knows and it would be naive to assume there aren't, but they haven't visited us. Why would they even if they could. There are many earth like uninhabited undamaged planets out there.

There are thousands of people staring at the sky looking for them and we don't have 1 single tangible piece of evidence. Not one clear photo - Nothing despite everyone having cameras in their pocket at all times in their phones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfRZQxgeP3o
 

Psy

Sealiner
considering the amount of Dark Matter, I think we just aren't observing the correct thing or thing's


http://science.nasa.gov/astrophysics/focus-areas/what-is-dark-energy/
 

Psy

Sealiner
:)


http://www.ewao.com/a/the-ultimate-evidence-earth-has-been-visited-by-intelligent-alien-civilizations/
 
Psy wrote:
:)


http://www.ewao.com/a/the-ultimate-evidence-earth-has-been-visited-by-intelligent-alien-civilizations/

I have one issue with this. He speaks of experts say its unlikely that they haven't visited earth... who are these experts? The experts i recognise are the physicists like Neil degreass Tyson, Lawrence Kraus, Michio Kaku etc. They are by far the most educated people on the planet and they all agree there is absolutely no evidence that we have been visited and they cannot see any reason why they would be interested in us specifically if they were out there.
 
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