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Serra Moz
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Joined: Sun Apr 15th, 2007
Location: Marracuene (The Bush), Mozambique
Posts: 4649
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I am still reading between the lines, have to see the "fine print + blue print"...

Amsterdam the 2nd coming up???

At least now the HAWKS and SAPS can concentrate on serious crimes.

Tool_Fan
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Joined: Mon Jun 18th, 2018
Location: Durbanville, South Africa
Posts: 40
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I do not really think the HAWKS and SAPS were concentrating on such crimes in anycase.

This just makes its now legal, that they do not need to concentrate on what shouldn't have been a crime in the first place.

Serra Moz
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Joined: Sun Apr 15th, 2007
Location: Marracuene (The Bush), Mozambique
Posts: 4649
Equipment: A - Z (Penn Rules)
Best Catch: Lots and Lots
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Tool_Fan wrote:
I do not really think the HAWKS and SAPS were concentrating on such crimes in anycase.

This just makes its now legal, that they do not need to concentrate on what shouldn't have been a crime in the first place.


Agreed... the Hawks + SAPS, was a bit of "tongue in cheek" chirp...

Dr halibut hoffman
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Joined: Wed Sep 16th, 2009
Location: Cape, South Africa
Posts: 2343
Equipment: Shimano, daiwa, a finnor and an elbe.. The rest died. ...
Best Catch: Shimano, daiwa, a finnor and an elbe.. The rest died. ...145cm FL Leervis released (Shore), 80kg+ yellowfin (Boat). 83cm Cracker. ...
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The cops were still breaking laws trying to target people smoking at home..in fact they were trying to come down hard on smokers before the judgement..
But now ahem..

I can smoke my doobie in peace and @#$% em.

I have cured my skin cancer twice with oil and cured my epilepsy and still had to deal with them @#$%'ers coming into my house and having to be worried about them breaking down my door for treating myself with meds that frankly work and are safe..I have been under doctors orders to smoke as much as I want and to NOT under any circumstance perform any watersport or be near water unless I am stoned off my face since the late 90's..I have maintained since I read the constitution before that it is my right and I been telling anyone who would listen for the 20 years since then..

No more BS..
I can smoke in peace..cops must go after real criminals now and leave the soft targets and nice/good people alone. Totsi breaks into my freinds house, guy steals some of his personal weed and later that day gets bust trying to sell it..next thing there is 12 cops breaking down my mates door in the middle of the night and he is all in the papers and has to sleep in the cells with murderers and rapists..Where's the @#%$' ing justice? Someone breaks into your house, your personal s#it gets stolen and next thing you are arrested for something which actually has since 1996 been your right.. No more..@#$% YEAH!

I have already had about 5 legal doobies in celebration..Playing snoop dawg on full volume, got a fatty burning ..niggas for life, enough with the bullS3hit..with God as my witness! Gotta be careful my personal stash will be finished quickly at this rate! Snoop double g! dawggy dawg!

Last edited on Tue Sep 18th, 2018 12:47 pm by Dr halibut hoffman

Dr halibut hoffman
Sealiner


Joined: Wed Sep 16th, 2009
Location: Cape, South Africa
Posts: 2343
Equipment: Shimano, daiwa, a finnor and an elbe.. The rest died. ...
Best Catch: Shimano, daiwa, a finnor and an elbe.. The rest died. ...145cm FL Leervis released (Shore), 80kg+ yellowfin (Boat). 83cm Cracker. ...
Favorite Fishing Spot: Kranse en diepsee!
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Had a spliff with each of my neighbors too to celebrate..

It is not like it not socially accepted anyway.LOL..

Time to plant some beans!

Wrote here years ago on human rights day that I was having a fatty in defience of then current lower laws and stated what the courts recognised today in terms of constitutional law. I feel completely vindicated for my stance and stand my my opinion. I am good freinds with lawyers that have been involved with this since the beginning. Seen enough cancers helped and some cured.. I had discussions years ago when I was one of the few that realised that it was a right..I said it was only a matter of time till lawyers, judges and politicians or their family members got the big C and then they would come screaming for oil and the whole circus would be shown for what it was..It has now happened, took a bit longer than I thought. But.. ja now I can't be a criminal for smoking a $#@'ing J. Thats %$@#'ing great.

Sorry for the swearing but I have had enough freinds wrongly, and now it seems illegal thrown in jail for a smelly plant that makes you high and fixes a host of ailments and is completely non toxic. No more..My body, my mind...@#%$ off! This will also open the legal door for magic mushrooms and and and..even coca leaf in tea is wonderful and I still miss the boxes I used to be able to buy off the shelf in Diskem. Now decriminalisation of all personal consumption is just a matter of time. Putting someone in jail does far more harm than most non habitual use of anything so the current apartheid era drug laws are wholly unconstitutional.. Gov' just aint realized it yet..or maybe they now are..;)

My body, my mind..hands off..I am not a criminal for exploring the plants around me. The wildest s#it i've encountered, you meet the ancestors, you meet the guardian angels, you meet the demons and everything in between..it grows all around you..found in thousands of plants, hundreds of our indigenous trees and grasses..and is as illegal as meth, and your brain also makes it.. been used by humans safely since the days of one tribe of san but illegal as heroin. When I gave it to my heroin addicted best freind, it made him quit the junk (unfortunately temporarily) but ja not for many years, I saw what I needed to, made my peace with the othersides..That is why I fish so much! Mortal life is too short to NOT do what you love and enjoy..The otherside is just there..so close..you can pass like that..and never come back to throw another line..but that is a story for another day LOL..anyway..legal precedent set. Applicable in many respects to personal use of anything..There is already a shroom case before the constitutional court and will also go the way the way the state would like I am guessing.

Last edited on Tue Sep 18th, 2018 01:12 pm by Dr halibut hoffman

Serra Moz
Sealiner


Joined: Sun Apr 15th, 2007
Location: Marracuene (The Bush), Mozambique
Posts: 4649
Equipment: A - Z (Penn Rules)
Best Catch: Lots and Lots
Favorite Fishing Spot: WorldWideWaters - (Fresh + Salt)
Boat: Got a few that can float
Club: Macaneta Ski Boat Club (MOZ)
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Dr halibut hoffman wrote:
The cops were still breaking laws trying to target people smoking at home..in fact they were trying to come down hard on smokers before the judgement..
But now ahem..

I can smoke my doobie in peace and @#$% em.

I have cured my skin cancer twice with oil and cured my epilepsy and still had to deal with them @#$%'ers coming into my house and having to be worried about them breaking down my door for treating myself with meds that frankly work and are safe..I have been under doctors orders to smoke as much as I want and to NOT under any circumstance perform any watersport or be near water unless I am stoned off my face since the late 90's..I have maintained since I read the constitution before that it is my right and I been telling anyone who would listen for the 20 years since then..

No more BS..
I can smoke in peace..cops must go after real criminals now and leave the soft targets and nice/good people alone. Totsi breaks into my freinds house, guy steals some of his personal weed and later that day gets bust trying to sell it..next thing there is 12 cops breaking down my mates door in the middle of the night and he is all in the papers and has to sleep in the cells with murderers and rapists..Where's the @#%$' ing justice? Someone breaks into your house, your personal s#it gets stolen and next thing you are arrested for something which actually has since 1996 been your right.. No more..@#$% YEAH!

I have already had about 5 legal doobies in celebration..Playing snoop dawg on full volume, got a fatty burning ..niggas for life, enough with the bullS3hit..with God as my witness! Gotta be careful my personal stash will be finished quickly at this rate! Snoop double g! dawggy dawg!



LOL...Amen bro!!! 100%, What's your take on oil for mild controlled / "almost" reversed Diabetes type ? I am healthy, but would like some "first hand input" should you have info on it?

Dr halibut hoffman
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Joined: Wed Sep 16th, 2009
Location: Cape, South Africa
Posts: 2343
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Best Catch: Shimano, daiwa, a finnor and an elbe.. The rest died. ...145cm FL Leervis released (Shore), 80kg+ yellowfin (Boat). 83cm Cracker. ...
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No opinion on it for diabetes..but hardly met a overweight stoner I'll tell you that.. I think the first defense for diabetes in terms of a plant is the medicinal mushroom reishi.. No sugar also haha..but that reishi i've seen do wonders for diabetes..and and and and and..

Serra Moz
Sealiner


Joined: Sun Apr 15th, 2007
Location: Marracuene (The Bush), Mozambique
Posts: 4649
Equipment: A - Z (Penn Rules)
Best Catch: Lots and Lots
Favorite Fishing Spot: WorldWideWaters - (Fresh + Salt)
Boat: Got a few that can float
Club: Macaneta Ski Boat Club (MOZ)
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Zero visibility in Durban I believe... misty and foggy...LOL up in smoke...On serious note, it will be interesting how this will pan out?

Dr halibut hoffman
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Location: Cape, South Africa
Posts: 2343
Equipment: Shimano, daiwa, a finnor and an elbe.. The rest died. ...
Best Catch: Shimano, daiwa, a finnor and an elbe.. The rest died. ...145cm FL Leervis released (Shore), 80kg+ yellowfin (Boat). 83cm Cracker. ...
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Serra Moz wrote: Zero visibility in Durban I believe... misty and foggy...LOL up in smoke...On serious note, it will be interesting how this will pan out?

LOL :hyst::hyst::hyst::hyst::hyst:

But ja fishing my drug..thats why I never fell off the rails while others did, so I teach the kids to fish..the world ahead is going to be even scarier than the one I grew up in.. But at least they can smoke a doobie in peace. Which will affect heroin sales and also beer sales as far as studies have shown. More weed smoke, less beer drunk and less smack addicts. Win. But fishing the reel addiction that is healthy. :) But I'm also partial to some fine cured skunk weed!

Last edited on Tue Sep 18th, 2018 01:16 pm by Dr halibut hoffman

Serra Moz
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Joined: Sun Apr 15th, 2007
Location: Marracuene (The Bush), Mozambique
Posts: 4649
Equipment: A - Z (Penn Rules)
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Dr halibut hoffman wrote:
Serra Moz wrote: Zero visibility in Durban I believe... misty and foggy...LOL up in smoke...On serious note, it will be interesting how this will pan out?

LOL :hyst::hyst::hyst::hyst::hyst:


We should 'create' a poll on SL, like (1) who smokes (2) who not (3) support the new law (4) against......LOL, remember back in the hey day, lots of "verkramptes" on SL...

If you have time 'draw up a poll' - just finished a shift at sea...dead tired...Let men know you if you are interested in doing a poll, of course should you have time?....Who love to see the stats...anyway so little activity on SL.. Perhaps it's time we lighten up and add a marijuana leave in the 'emoticions'....LOL

trevour
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I guess our take on this will vary according to our own history and experience. I smoked for over 20 years. Personally I find life much better without it. In my case it was definately not medicinal, and I got involved in much stronger stuff that got me six months in rehab. But I am not one who believes or blames weed as a gateway drug. I have however seen enough people with negative effects from weed. Psychosis probably being the worst, and it is "fairly" common. Also lots of stories of underachieving etc. I know I am probably somewhat outspoken on this, but for me weed should remain illegal.

Dr halibut hoffman
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Location: Cape, South Africa
Posts: 2343
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Best Catch: Shimano, daiwa, a finnor and an elbe.. The rest died. ...145cm FL Leervis released (Shore), 80kg+ yellowfin (Boat). 83cm Cracker. ...
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People thinking they can tell me to what to do with my own body and mind..should be unlawful..as according to the constitution is. Ahem.

Just because my dad was a raging and wife beating alcoholic is no reason you should not be able to enjoy a beer in your own lounge without it "creating paranoia" cause the cops want to bust down your door. HAHAHA no more..of this sillyness. You may have a problem with me doing weed but hey now that is your problem and not mine. I have my entire adult life told anyone, in law enforcement or otherwise to go jump in lake if they have a problem with me getting goofed. And all along it seems I was right.. Now that is a good feeling let me tell you. ;) Fucking vindicated! And I have multiple medical conditions effectively treated with weed but I also just like to get stoned..one of lifes great pleasures along with catching fish as far as I am concerned..

In the words of the great late Bill Hicks, " Don't you figure that making nature against the law, um I don't know, maybe seems a bit unnatural?" LOL

Sense is prevailing..

Now when you really get into it, take the most powerful, reality shattering substance in the world.. DMT, schedule 7, made by our body everyday, all day long, then add an oxygen and hydrogen to point 5 on the carbon ring and boom you have serotonin, which we also make in our body..move it one corner over to the 4th position and you have psilocin in the shrooms, schedule 7, move it one more corner and you get bufotenin (toad skins) which is also schedule 7 and made in our bodies..and you trip everynight when you dream..what a joke !! So illegal, or is it? Thus making your body and every cops and every judges body a schedule 7 drug factory all the time. The law has no basis in reality or science. None. Whatsoever. At the moment it illegalises half of nature without realising this. I have been aware of this for years and years and have more than a decade ago had cases thrown out when confronting magistrates with the real-ity of the world around us. ;) We still do not even have the full picture science wise..I've eaten at least two species of trippy mushrooms found wild here that are not even known to science..what the law got to say, we don't even know they exist..haha and they are unlawful apparently..no not when it ends up in the courtroom.

You do what you want..just that now, no you don't get to tell me what to do because you can't handle your own s#it..nomore..haha.

If I get loose now it is because I have started on the liquor! A celebration is in order!!

Last edited on Tue Sep 18th, 2018 03:50 pm by Dr halibut hoffman

JD
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Serra Moz wrote:


We should 'create' a poll on SL, like (1) who smokes (2) who not (3) support the new law (4) against......LOL, remember back in the hey day, lots of "verkramptes" on SL...



Include in the poll (5) - uses oil(not smoking)

Last edited on Tue Sep 18th, 2018 03:17 pm by JD

Dr halibut hoffman
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It has been said before that weed is such a powerful drug it even creates delusions in non users..especially the delusion where non smokers think they have the right to tell weed smokers what to do. hahahaha You are an example of that. Weed did make you deluded, and the government.. to think they have the right to tell me what to do in the privacy of my own home!
Fuck off no one has that right unless I am affecting your life which I am not. I am tired of people that think they have the right to meddle in other peoples personal affairs because of their own misconceptions and misgivings. No more.

Rolling down the road smoking endo, sippin gin and juice..fuk em..laid baaaaaaack!

If you miss the reference..today is not your day. dont worry about it , its all good!

Dr halibut hoffman
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It is no longer about what people think..Because the judges have already thought. It is now about respect of my rights. My lawyer is waiting to sue anyone who does not respect my right to cannabis...LOL

Time to light another..that was the appeal, state lost..thanks for coming..light it up..Boom. Om namah shivaia namah!

Dr halibut hoffman
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Best Catch: Shimano, daiwa, a finnor and an elbe.. The rest died. ...145cm FL Leervis released (Shore), 80kg+ yellowfin (Boat). 83cm Cracker. ...
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I am not fishing today..nor working...I am smoking myself smoking smoking smokin...gotta meet up with my lawyers later and smoke some more with them..cause it is not like they don't smoke hahahaha nor jufges for that matter hahahaha the police been kidding themselves to not think that we all smoke..I smoked with policemen before for the record hahaha the joke is over..

Last edited on Tue Sep 18th, 2018 03:29 pm by Dr halibut hoffman

Dr halibut hoffman
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Persecution is over..for a little F'ing joint! What a great F'ing day!

Dr halibut hoffman
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Best Catch: Shimano, daiwa, a finnor and an elbe.. The rest died. ...145cm FL Leervis released (Shore), 80kg+ yellowfin (Boat). 83cm Cracker. ...
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Used to know policemen with the narcotics unit that would be busting merchants on a thursday and on friday be at the pub with us trying to be all cool and all bragging about his busts and rolling joints for everyone with the confiscated stash trying to fit it.. So wrong. So corrupt. So glad it is over..Meanwhile home invasions with guns and rapes on the up, murders, theft, hijackings on the up, seas being raped, boat motors being stolen left right and centre..but police resources wasted and courts time wasted going hard after "rokers"..Glad they can now stop wasting their time and go get some real criminals now.

Dr halibut hoffman
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My best freind was a heroin junkie for 20 years..good f'ing man he was, rest in peace.. 20 years the junk could not kill him, came close once or twice, you know what got him in the end? Not the junk but a useless absent nurse and a f'king legal plain old sleeping tab that he was given in the rehab..he passed out and choked to death on some of mommies best fudge in rehab with no one watching over him even though there was supposed to be 24/7 medical supervision. Left 2 kids behind trying his hardest to be clean. Making things illegal never fixed anything..look at the worlds oldest profession, never been legal but still going strong, the worlds oldest profession LOL making something that is a personal choice unlawful seemed to work out well..but lets just keep on pressing the same button and expecting a different response..that is how some define insanity..LOL

That is the problem with drugs, most of the problem is created by the fact that they are illegal in the first place and or ignorant misuse or the problem or distuption that jail creates or that they are illegal one does not know what one is taking or how it is tainted or what the dose is supposed to be. It has been shown in real life all over the world now, decriminalise and respect individual rights and treat as medical issue rather than criminal issue and the problem goes right back in the box. That simple. medical issues should be dealt with by doctors..not policemen. Policemen should deal with real stuff like gangsters and violent crime etc..
This above goes for hard and soft drugs.

Last edited on Tue Sep 18th, 2018 05:00 pm by Dr halibut hoffman

Dr halibut hoffman
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Best Catch: Shimano, daiwa, a finnor and an elbe.. The rest died. ...145cm FL Leervis released (Shore), 80kg+ yellowfin (Boat). 83cm Cracker. ...
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There are people on this forum who have kids with multiple seizures a day who can now grow CBD cannabis strains at home and make oil and dose the kids without them getting high...and not have to worry about the cops busting down the door and getting fired from their jobs..and not have to deal with the seizures and cost of import CBD products, such a great day!

Cannabis pretty much cures epilepsy for those that did not know. I used to be grand mal epileptic.

Swopped my epilim 400mg's for THC 250mg 20 years ago and I feel great! Not a fit since. Boom like that.

Last edited on Tue Sep 18th, 2018 05:07 pm by Dr halibut hoffman

willem wikkel spies
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liewe wereld maar die dr is weer besig.!!!!
te veel joints lyk dit vir my.

the big thing is, is that it will lead to other stuff!!!
more serious stuff and that does cost more money.

this will lead to crime.

yes it does have a medicinal value, if used correctly.

but, when you on a high and decide to drive and you cause the death of another person....what now?

neewat, sal maar moet sien.
as my kind dit wil try in my huis......dan het hy sopas uitgetrek sonder die gee van kennis.

in the old days, we pulled out thousands of plants.
caught plenty distributers.
etc.

atr least now, the price will tumble...grow your own shyte.
smoke your own shyte.
and stay home, when doing so.

Gholfnut
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I am all for individual rights
What happens when someone is intoxicated with any substance taken themselves and they commit an atrocity against someone else - My view is that it should count to make such actions worse!! The main problem with the loss of morality is because society now values individual rights above society rights.

Dr halibut hoffman
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The morality of telling someone else what to do based on your own beliefs is very murky. We have just lived in a country where it was considered normal for many years. It is not normal. Go overseas to a free country and people will be shocked if you tell someone what to smoke or wear or how to have their hair or what god to follow based on what we would believe to be true. In any case our laws grant us more freedoms than they do overseas. Time for recognition of that. Beliefs are just that, beliefs..not truths or fact or anything like that, the time that others who do not yet realize that, can enforce their beliefs over others who believe something different is coming to a close. After that all the only avenue we have to effect or force our belief on others is civilized debate, how nice. The rule of law and letter has prevailed.

LOL willem when and if your son smokes in your home you can still bliksem him behind the ears as it is your home and you make the rules there..

If he does choose to though now he can get it by his own hands and not have to meet gangsters or dodgy people or get exposed to hard drugs through the process which is one of the big problems with illegal weed. Now he does not have to deal with dealers that will push hard drugs onto him is the main win. And he will be far more likely to do it in a safe environment in someones home. Win as far as reality is concerned. For the millions of township kids, they can now get a smoke when older without getting exposed to whonga(smack) or meth which are the real evils..for example. Fact is most kids experiment, harm reduction is the key..education is the key. Drugs for the most part dont help any situaion. But then again sometimes they can be great tools for understanding or counseling. Sometimes they can lead to great k@k. Othertimes like the beer I am having now they can just be great to unwind. Anyway it is ones own personal choice now officially. I am freinds with old policemen and now I can be frank and smoke in front of them in my home, before I would not before out of respect..Although i'd ask them first if they minded out of respect. I have never hid the fact that I smoke ever.. I have multiple medical reasons and enjoy it and have not felt ashamed for a long long time.

Better to be do none at all though, no beer, no ciggies, no spliff etc..

 But if I choose to it is my choice..sometimes a spliff is great and sometimes a beer goes down like a house on fire..life is like that? Like a great coffee in the morning..Like some of lifes richest moments get created out of a pot of rich morning brew..but best to be a monk and do nothing agreed..but then even they make their own hooch and have a mantra and use it to climb mountains in ritual..Life must have a little spice..otherwise it is too bland.. Even William Shakespear had a little doobie in his pipe, the archeology has shown that.. ;)

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/theatre/william-shakespeare/11792533/Cannabis-discovered-in-tobacco-pipes-found-in-William-Shakespeares-garden.html

Last edited on Tue Sep 18th, 2018 07:02 pm by Dr halibut hoffman

trevour
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Until personal choice impacts others, and that really is what Willem is highlighting. I've not met a smoker who does not smoke and drive, or at the very least they are the minority. As for the kid who wants a joint, chances are he will still be hiding the fact that he is smoking from the folks, same as cigarettes, and will thus still be purchasing his weed. I can't see this taking the gangster out of the equation, especially with regards to the youth, perhaps for those who have been smoking for years. Medicinal - no problem, but lets facebit that is the small market.

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Like your personal choice impacting me? You not get that?

Dr halibut hoffman
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Why should your personal choice to NOT smoke as an adult affect my choice to smoke as an adult? That has far worse implications for society and is the basis of modern freedom. The opposite is when you start eroding personal freedoms you quickly end up in a fascist regime. Been proven over time and again..In germany..here..etc..

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Imagine a non beer drinker running arounf thinking he can tell other beer drinkers not to drink beers..
Preposterous
.Except beer is more harmful that cannabis. Been proven over and over and over and so over..It is just like it has seemed normal to act the fool and walk over peoples rights unless you were aware of it in which case you were more likely to have your rights walked apon..

But ja..imagine if one of the kind and gentle muslim brothers on here was telling us about how we must be locked up for drinking beer and that beer must be illegal because he had a problem with beer once. That would be absurd. But it has been happening everyday with the weed. Even with folks like me who have healed their own cancer and helped others..getting harrassed. Thank god it is over, I might plant a seed tomorrow.. Get that CBD only cutting someone promised me.. For day time smoke to get work done and not have fits and not get stoned, win win..I can treat myself now and get a lab to test and see what I am taking..great.

If you choose not to smoke I am completely OK with that..If you choose to not agree with the 'erb that's great too, that is the whole point of freedom of choice, that is the the fight that has been fought, and now won. Now everyone can believe what they want and not be bothered, either way. Civil like.

It is not for everyone..If you don't smoke don't start. Like ciggies. If you have epilepsy and are tired of the side effects of the meds..light up. My fits never came back except one time when I was not stoned and had a few beers and was on playstation. If you drink beer or don't hey thats your thing..I also enjoy a pint.

Last edited on Tue Sep 18th, 2018 07:34 pm by Dr halibut hoffman

willem wikkel spies
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neewat, die koel is deur die kerk!
dwars deur en ergste is, hyt niks getref nie.
dis waar,, William Shakespeare did smoke weed too, and the bugger also wrote a bunch of shyte non can understand.

this is common knowledge, so, did he write the shyte when he was on aaap twak?

must have been!!!

willem wikkel spies is the Afrikaans for William shakespear…. but I don't smoke weed....I just write a bunch of nonsense, without having had a aaptwak.

sterkte en geniet hom.
as hy vir jou werk, dan werk hy…...

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Nee wat ek weet jy rook nie..We can agree to disagree LOL..was just teasing you because of your name :)

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ek raad te dronk nou om meer to skryf so n' ander tyd..n goeie dag dit was!

The memes on twitter about cape town, durbs and jozies and also the rastas on the steps of court were hilarious..

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hay De-wetch....como vai vc rapaiz?

:)

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willem wikkel spies wrote: neewat, die koel is deur die kerk! dwars deur en ergste is, hyt niks getref nie. dis waar,, William Shakespeare did smoke weed too, and the bugger also wrote a bunch of shyte non can understand. this is common knowledge, so, did he write the shyte when he was on aaap twak? must have been!!! willem wikkel spies is the Afrikaans for William shakespear…. but I don't smoke weed....I just write a bunch of nonsense, without having had a aaptwak. sterkte en geniet hom. as hy vir jou werk, dan werk hy…...


rerig ja...die koel is in die kerk se ***!::tight:

Last edited on Tue Sep 18th, 2018 08:14 pm by Psy

Dr halibut hoffman
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Just read the full judgement..the judge pretty much summed it up so nicely..said all I did in much better words..even quoted a case on privacy that basically said if you can have porn in your home and I disagree, whos to say I can't smoke dobbie if you disagree and went on to say that that is the basis of a healthy democratic country and I fully agree!

Its not like my muslim buddies lecture me on my beer or whiskey drinking..and i don't lecture them on religion, and they don't lecture me and I call them over when the fish are biting and we allhave fun together and slowly we edge closer to a civil society..Today I thank the highest court in the land for standing up for the common man!

Last edited on Tue Sep 18th, 2018 09:22 pm by Dr halibut hoffman

Dr halibut hoffman
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Also went on to say that it is recognised even in old literature as being used topically in cancer and that you dont get high from bathing in it and that the amount for personal consumption is not limited. And by chance I was lucky enough to be given a whole lot of oil that I do bath in for skin cancer and now there is nothing that can be done about where as before I had to deal with people trying to lock me up for bathing in a plant oil LOL which is actually ridiculous but till today the kind of crap i'd have to deal with. which I always said I was going to do defiently and so was given oil for free to do so as the universe goes so I could be the example as I have no shame when it comes to my cannabis use and used to smoke in front of the station when younger and post the constitutional law on the window with the sections that the court ruled on today underlined..so I feel great today. I was right all along.eventually I found lawyers to listen to my side it was only a matter of time till cancer hit.. So nice now that all those nice and kind people that helped me in the illegal past with free weed and free oil so I could get it to cancer patients for free can't get thrown in jail for their kindness in the face of jail. So nice. I'm going to soak in a big bath with oil tonight just to celebrate..its anti inflammatory effect in the bath or rubbed in is profound and on par with NSAI like ibuprofin or a transact patch or something..ask me I suffer from a bad back/knees/ankle/hips..all out..sometimes I cant get out of bed from pain and I am young still but if I rub the stuff on my muscles it works wonders..or bath in it..eish now we are talking..

Was just on saturday that my freinds dad came to me and said, look! its gone..and then ran off and got a lump of himself that was lying on the bedside table that his body had ejected. It was the big cancer lump on his forehead that had fallen off..I held it in my hand the other evening..and then..ja.. then..was quite a crazy night..my neighbor can now grow his own in peace, he cooks it into coconut oil and baths in it and his skin cancer is getting better and better..For skin cancers the stuff is unreal..for other cancers I'd start of non trippy medical mushrooms first.. anyways night folks..more is nog n dag..

For those that dont want to get high and want the health benefits, you can now grow at home any potent strain and then juice it and then you won't get high but get full benefit..Must be live juiced then it wont get to the brain but will get to the body..That is the other major bonus of this judgement is for all the non drug use, non stoners that want the health benefits. They can now do it in peace. Juice the live plant then the THC is of a form that wont get you high. Not everyone wants to get high that that is the whole point in that everyone has the choice to do what they like in the privacy of their own home so long that you are not affecting others. The research that it helps prevent certain cancers is beyond doubt, but there is more to it, some mushrooms are more effective, all together is most but there is circumstance and diet and and and.. I am lucky, the skin cancer I affected by, my first was chopped out when I was 10 or 11, seems to get nailed by the THC..I also take reishi mushroom but have the last cancer was by my tear duct so I could not rub the oil on. I had no choice but to ingest a gram a day by smoke or vape of oil which I did and the cancer disappeared before my eye ;).. I mean what judge is going to argue with that?

Hey this was my post 1969! Summer of love baby!

Last edited on Tue Sep 18th, 2018 09:20 pm by Dr halibut hoffman

Psy
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The Water Bearer (Aquarius) ...brings Fresh sustenance to all.

After all...we are but 80%+ water !!

Serra Moz
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Psy wrote:
hay De-wetch....como vai vc rapaiz?

:)


Todo! Como vai contigo! Eu...so no Congo amigo!

And now "blare" is legal bro!

Abré
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What does any of this have to do with fishing??

Serra Moz
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Abré wrote:
What does any of this have to do with fishing??


If you view the "section" or heading under which this topic was posted.... you will note that it's called the 'LOUNGE' open discussion, non fishing included, I would suggest you, read the rules and get a grip, looks like you are NEW here??... best you follow the trend... Thanks, BTW: It's so much better to fish and relax next to the water after you had a "skyf" or 2? :welcomesea::welcomesea::welcomesea::welcomesea:

Last edited on Wed Sep 19th, 2018 04:02 am by Serra Moz

MichaelK
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This judgement makes things a little tricky for employers enforcing their substance abuse policy.

The Occupational Health and Safety act demands that an employer must ensure that the workplace is safe. This includes making sure that nobody operates dangerous machinery whilest inebriated.

Please note this include abuse of prescription medication as well, any substance that will cause a person to be in an altered state of mind.

The problem for employers becomes the monitoring / testing part with dagga.

Dagga can stay in a persons system for up to 2 weeks, this obviously does not mean that after consumption, 2 weeks later the individul is still stoned. However the drug is still present in his or her system and when conducting a urine or saliva test, a positive result will be indicated.

According to most substance abuse policies in place this will result in the employee being prevented from entering the work place. The employer will be well within their right to institute disciplinary action against the employee, as with an inebriating substance being present in their systems they effectively place all employees in their workplace at risk.

The only true way to effectively monitor the level of cannabis or THC in your system is to conduct a spectrophotometric test, which at current prices costs around R2000 per test.

So this is going to make things very difficult for employers at the moment.

Labour and law enforcement are going to have to come up with answers very quickly.

The other issue away from work is will one get prosecuted for driving stoned and what level of THC in your blood stream would constitute an offence to be on the road

Last edited on Wed Sep 19th, 2018 08:17 am by MichaelK

Serra Moz
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MichaelK wrote:
This judgement makes things a little tricky for employers enforcing their substance abuse policy.

The Occupational Health and Safety act demands that an employer must ensure that the workplace is safe. This includes making sure that nobody operates dangerous machinery whilest inebriated.

Please note this include abuse of prescription medication as well, any substance that will cause a person to be in an altered state of mind.

The problem for employers becomes the monitoring / testing part with dagga.




Dagga can stay in a persons system for up to 2 weeks, this obviously does not mean that after consumption, 2 weeks later the individula is still stoned. However the drug is still present in his or her system and when conducting a urine or saliva test, a positive result will be indicated.

According to most substance abuse policys in place this will result in the employee being prevented from entering the work place or be placed. The employer will be well within their right to institute disciplinary action against the employee, as due to an inebriating substance being present in their systems they effectively place all employees in their workplace at risk.

The only true way to effectively monitor the level of cannabis or THC in your system is to conduct a spectrophotometric test, which at current prices costs around R2000 per test.

So this is going to make things very difficult for employers at the moment.



Consider this, some okes smokes 1 x joint and they are F&&&K out of their skulls - then heads to the couch with the remote and a packet of chips, some chockies and a 2ltr sprite, now... this goofball is toast for the next few hours, and lazy another fellow smokes 4 x joints a day, drives to work, perform well at work, family man blah blah... That's the difference, now for the non smokers it's like this, John can drink 15 beers and remains in control of himself... mannered etc, now Peter drinks 5 black labels and takes on the crowd, throws over tables etc....LOL.. complicated!

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Serra Moz i get your point, however its irrelevant how an individual handles his or her alcohol or zolletjie, its the level of THC or alcohol in ones system thats important

It becomes a problem with alcohol when an individual does a breatherlizer trying to enter through security to get into his place of work. If he is over the limit then he is prevented from entering and reported to HR.

With Dagga, you get home on friday and have a spliff. On monday morning going to work, you are singled out and made to take a saliva or urine test. Your results will show positive.

Now another person may be sitting in his car 2 min away from work and smoking up a storm. Then 5 min later he trys to enter his place of work. The same saliva or urine test will be performed and will show a positive just like the previous example.

Thats why im saying things are going to become very difficult for employers to monitor the levels of THC in a person system inorder to determine if they are at an acceptable level to be at work or not.

Last edited on Wed Sep 19th, 2018 08:35 am by MichaelK

Serra Moz
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MichaelK wrote:
Serra Moz i get your point, however its irrelevant how an individual handles his or her alcohol or zolletjie, its the level of THC or alcohol in ones system thats important

It becomes a problem with alcohol when an individual does a breatherlizer trying to enter through security to get into his place of work. If he is over the limit then he is prevented from entering and reported to HR.

With Dagga, you get home on friday and have a spliff. On monday morning going to work, you are singled out and made to take a saliva or urine test. Your results will show positive.

Now another person may be sitting in his car 2 min away from work and smoking up a storm. Then 5 min later he trys to enter his place of work. The same saliva or urine test will be performed and will show a positive just like the previous example.

Thats why im saying things are going to become very difficult for employers to monitor the levels of THC in a person system inorder to determine if they are at an acceptable level to be at work or not.



Bro ...ask us okes the works in the maritme / oil & gas outfits.... 100% what you said..sad indeed. We do medicals... weed in system you are gone... as with an oke that did Coke or Heroin or Speed a few days before will normally pass the medical... so there you back to square

willem wikkel spies
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MichaelK wrote:
This judgement makes things a little tricky for employers enforcing their substance abuse policy.

The Occupational Health and Safety act demands that an employer must ensure that the workplace is safe. This includes making sure that nobody operates dangerous machinery whilest inebriated.

Please note this include abuse of prescription medication as well, any substance that will cause a person to be in an altered state of mind.

The problem for employers becomes the monitoring / testing part with dagga.

Dagga can stay in a persons system for up to 2 weeks, this obviously does not mean that after consumption, 2 weeks later the individul is still stoned. However the drug is still present in his or her system and when conducting a urine or saliva test, a positive result will be indicated.

According to most substance abuse policies in place this will result in the employee being prevented from entering the work place. The employer will be well within their right to institute disciplinary action against the employee, as with an inebriating substance being present in their systems they effectively place all employees in their workplace at risk.

The only true way to effectively monitor the level of cannabis or THC in your system is to conduct a spectrophotometric test, which at current prices costs around R2000 per test.

So this is going to make things very difficult for employers at the moment.

Labour and law enforcement are going to have to come up with answers very quickly.

The other issue away from work is will one get prosecuted for driving stoned and what level of THC in your blood stream would constitute an offence to be on the road


interesting, but....why do we want to make things difficult.
use technology man.
make video recordings etc. no need for stupid expensive tests.

you cannot fight a video recording.

all you need is the employee who took the video to testify that she/ he took it.
they are witnesses and the video recording will basically proof their testimony.


but I agree. interesting times ahead.
its not a free for all.

big circles are going to be made....watch this space

trevour
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My understanding is that testing positive on a urine test, will not be grounds for any sort of legal or disciplinary action. You would need evidence that proves that they are under the influence at work or whatever the situation may be.

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trevour wrote:
My understanding is that testing positive on a urine test, will not be grounds for any sort of legal or disciplinary action. You would need evidence that proves that they are under the influence at work or whatever the situation may be.


LOL... your understanding is 100% wrong... In the Maritime industry - you do a "piss test" - if positive.. they will do a second test right there and then, and then you gone!

Last edited on Wed Sep 19th, 2018 09:33 am by Serra Moz

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I wonder how the drug testing at work relates to individual rights of privacy enshrined in the constitution, if one is testing for employees that smoked on the weekend, on monday..that is pretty ethically wrong and if you are testing using a methodology for employees stoned on monday and also catching ones that got stoned in their own time on the weekend, one is not even considering the ethical implications of that which in itself has legal implications.

This is now a brave new world, where my rights have now for the first time have got to be respected..Many will now struggle to get their heads around that but hey, their problem not mine as said before.. Employers will now have to implement an ethical means of work place drug testing. And I think that it is just and fair on the stoners who have been victimised (illegally) for far too long. Now they can sue you. Boom. The weekend being their private time and all? The laws that have been recognized in this judgement have been in place since '96. The employers, government, police etc.. have been acting illegally since '96 let me remind you, the judgement is just a recognition of that. If my personal stash gets confiscated now, I can lay charges of theft with the police and they have to investigate..hows that?! LOL :)

It is time to get ones head around one does not have ownership over another adults body or mind? In an employee situation, one is renting their time and their skills for the time when they are working and nothing more than that..

On the note of workplace safetly, some of the biggest party animals I have known have been the PILOTS! LOL They just tended to drink beer, lots and lots of it as it passed through the system quick enough if they kept the tolerance high enough. A very dangerous workaround to the current failed workplace drug testing policies. In addition they had a penchant for novel and powerful psychedelics which would not be picked up on any test and most anyway were so close to existing brain chemicals that they could not be picked up as an anomaly if one tried with the best technology. There will always be a way to beat a test. In the old days of the tour da france, when it was legal, the hill climbers hearts used to explode (it happened hence making sport doping illegal) after eating 200 amphetamine tablets on the way up the hill..Now that it is all illegal (rightly so in sport competition), to think cheating does not happen would be foolish. Now it is all off season doping with doctors (it happens, I have known olympic athletes and was told most dope or they can't compete at the top in such a short carreer) and now with blood transfusions and lithium polymer batteries inside the bicycle tubes and hub based secret motors it just gets creative! Humans will always find a way to get around the accepted norm and push the boundary, it is in our nature. It is as human as getting pissed or having another human.

But ja michael the flip side of your point, is what when employers realize that a large percentage of employees were actually getting stoned all along and everyone was unaware until now, that we are looking. And then what when the labour pools dry up as stoners are excluded, and then the employers and industry are forced to accept them and give up on testing for most applications?

That has already happened in the states. The trend was noticed in 2013/4 as far as I know and up to today, the stoners can all get employed now in most industries (where safety is not paramount). In fact also the legal cannabis industry itself, in the states, now employs more people than the dental industry. California is the one state that never had a recession and has one of the biggest and most vibrant industries of any place on the planet, it also has one of the highest per capita cannabis consumption levels. Food for thought.

Notice below the emphasis on "workplace safety" , but also "respecting the law". In our case the law was not signed into force yesterday, it was signed into force in '96. Yesterday the highest court of the land recognized that the law was not being adhered to and demanded that it was.

https://www.cnbc.com/2014/09/17/marijuana-nearly-10-percent-of-americans-go-to-work-high-survey.html

" Smaller businesses, meanwhile, with limited resources to test employees are in the early stages of figuring out next steps. Even in places like Colorado where recreational cannabis use is legal, employers are trying to strike a balance between respecting the law and establishing clear workplace rules.

Christopher Myers, co-founder of BodeTree, a 15-employee start-up based in Denver, says he has yet to create a policy strictly for marijuana use in the workplace.

As an online service that helps small businesses manage and understand their finances, BodeTree has to comply with financial institutions' policies for protecting client data. Myers said there's a zero tolerance policy when it comes to substance use on the job.

"It's an interesting balance, because we need a policy that is compliant with federal and state law," he said. "And we are respectful of those laws. But we don't want someone showing up to work drunk, on Vicodin or high on marijuana."

For now, Myers isn't performing spot testing for marijuana consumption on employees.

"The testing technology in Denver will detect if you have been using marijuana in the past 30 days," he said. "From a policy point of view, no one knows how to handle it."
More drug testing?

Curtis Graves, staff attorney at Mountain States Employers Council in Colorado, says there has been somewhat of a spike in employer drug testing since pot was legalized in 2013, but this is a nationwide trend.

"In Colorado, there was interest in having new drug policies, and adding language to existing policies so that workers know regardless of legalization, they can't use on or off duty at work," Graves said.

If workers test positive in Colorado, while on duty at work, they can be terminated for cause, Graves said.

For now, Myers of BodeTree says he hasn't had any issues with on-site marijuana usage, and hasn't decided yet if he will be changing his policy.

"We are keenly observing the landscape right now—it will be an interesting couple of years across the country, if you look state-by-state, the momentum is toward legalization right now. It's inevitable, so just like with any human resources issue or company policy, it's never cut and dry," Myers says. "It will take employers time to figure out the right path."

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/careers/employment-trends/2018/05/03/labor-shortage-businesses-mellow-over-hiring-pot-smokers/573710002/

"Twenty-nine states and Washington D.C, have legalized the use of medical marijuana and on top of that, nine states have legalized recreational pot. But the question is, why was it illegal in the first place?"

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-03-05/the-coming-decline-of-the-employment-drug-test

"Employers are struggling to hire workers in the tightening U.S. job market. Marijuana is now legal in nine states and Washington, D.C., meaning more than one in five American adults can eat, drink, smoke or vape as they please. The result is the slow decline of pre-employment drug tests, which for decades had been a requirement for new recruits in industries ranging from manufacturing to finance.

As of the beginning of 2018, Excellence Health Inc., a Las Vegas-based health care company with around 6,000 employees, no longer drug tests people coming to work for the pharmaceutical side of the business. The company stopped testing for marijuana two years ago. “We don’t care what people do in their free time,” said Liam Meyer, a company spokesperson. “We want to help these people, instead of saying: ‘Hey, you can’t work for us because you used a substance,’” he added. The company also added a hotline for any workers who might be struggling with drug use.

Last month, AutoNation Inc., the largest U.S. auto dealer, announced it would no longer refuse job applicants who tested positive for weed. The Denver Post, owned by Digital First Media, ended pre-employment drug testing for all non-safety sensitive positions in September 2016. "

So you have to adapt as an employer. The same way the smokers have had to adapt to UNLAWFUL persecution for the last 22 years here in SA. ;) Gotta love it. Justice has been served.

Last edited on Wed Sep 19th, 2018 11:14 am by Dr halibut hoffman

Dr halibut hoffman
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Serra Moz wrote: trevour wrote:
My understanding is that testing positive on a urine test, will not be grounds for any sort of legal or disciplinary action. You would need evidence that proves that they are under the influence at work or whatever the situation may be.


LOL... your understanding is 100% wrong... In the Maritime industry - you do a "piss test" - if positive.. they will do a second test right there and then, and then you gone!

Piss test wont stand up for anything as they are not quantitative but qualitative tests, they are however highly sensitive and will indicate for a second blood test which will have to be done right there and then for legal proof, same as dronk driving..The blood test will show that the person was recently stoned or not recently stoned or has not been stoned at all like the famous secondary stoned snowboarder who went to court and had his medals right fully given back to him. The reason the blood test not done most times is cost. It cost less to stamp on someones rights, so employers have en mass. But they won't be able to do that anymore, now if they want to be hard, then they will have to pay to be hard. It is Just. But as above articles show, it then gets them a reputation for being hard which can hinder or help them depending on the industry. It is allowing nature to take its course as opposed to trying to steer the unsteerable and creating human collateral damage along the way. ;)

https://deadspin.com/how-a-stoned-canadian-changed-sports-history-990167249

Some history..he fought it after winning a medal, then getting stripped of it for second hand smoke levels in later blood tests, after a piss test picked him up..He got given his medal back. It costs more to get the truth so employers/olympic commitees would generally rather go for the cheaper option, even if there is innocent collateral damage. This event started a debate in Canada which raged till this year only when full legalization was achieved. Our constitution affords more rights than theirs and we have more freedoms..It is coming..don't worry. It is the pharmaceutical zealots that are going to have to make the adjustments not the commoners this time round. The many wheels are slowly turning that have long ago been set in motion, the wheels of justice in SA grind slow but they grind fine..

Last edited on Thu Sep 20th, 2018 10:36 am by Dr halibut hoffman

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My understanding is not 100% wrong. In the maritime industry..... Let me remind you that something changed as recently as yesterday. Before yesterday it was not legal to smoke. The maritime industry are not excluded from the new law, and having thc in ones system as a result of smoking in the comfort of ones home is no longer going to be a dismissable offence.

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Dr halibut hoffman wrote:
Serra Moz wrote: trevour wrote:
My understanding is that testing positive on a urine test, will not be grounds for any sort of legal or disciplinary action. You would need evidence that proves that they are under the influence at work or whatever the situation may be.


LOL... your understanding is 100% wrong... In the Maritime industry - you do a "piss test" - if positive.. they will do a second test right there and then, and then you gone!

Piss test wont stand up for anything as they are not quantitative but qualitative tests, they are however highly sensitive and will indicate for a second blood test which will have to be done right there and then for legal proof, same as dronk driving..The blood test will show that the person was recently stoned or not recently stoned. The reason the blood test not done most times is cost. It cost less to stamp on someones rights, so employers have en mass. But they won't be able to do that anymore, now if they want to be hard, then they will have to pay to be hard. It is Just. But as above articles show, it then gets them a reputation for being hard which can hinder or help them depending on the industry. It is allowing nature to take its course as opposed to trying to steer the unsteerable and creating human collateral damage along the way. ;)



It's in our pre employment contract + company policy bro!

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trevour wrote:
My understanding is not 100% wrong. In the maritime industry..... Let me remind you that something changed as recently as yesterday. Before yesterday it was not legal to smoke. The maritime industry are not excluded from the new law, and having thc in ones system as a result of smoking in the comfort of ones home is no longer going to be a dismissable offence.

You worked or are working in the Maritime Industry? No I guess not, we have international laws, likewise for my Dutch co-workers from Amsterdam...LOL... they will get sacked if tested positive...

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trevour wrote:
My understanding is not 100% wrong. In the maritime industry..... Let me remind you that something changed as recently as yesterday. Before yesterday it was not legal to smoke. The maritime industry are not excluded from the new law, and having thc in ones system as a result of smoking in the comfort of ones home is no longer going to be a dismissable offence.

Simple - SA Law, vs International Law or international Maritime Law for that matter... So they will let goofball Pilots fly? LOL...

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If the maritime industry have a set of laws to themselves, or follow an international standard then perhaps I am wrong on that, but that makes me 0.1% wrong which is nowhere near your 100%

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trevour wrote:
If the maritime industry have a set of laws to themselves, or follow an international standard then perhaps I am wrong on that, but that makes me 0.1% wrong which is nowhere near your 100%

Jizzuz... what you on about... that is what I said.. And I am sure that the transportation services - bus - trains - planes will follow the same route... Own set of rules.. doen't matter if Planet Mars allows you to do 8 ballers in church or Utophia allows you to snort lines in KFC... there's a thin blue line..

Tied into pre employment + on the job rules + regs

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In workplace if you are on drugs in industries where safety is paramount, you'll get fired whether drug is legal or not..you can't as said rock up pissed.

Nothing has changed..In all law it must be proven..in contract, criminal, common etc..For proof you require a blood test. A piss test is and will only ever be an indication. Legal precedent has long been set in that regard. But ja you prove that they were recently enough stoned and they are fired.. Cant be goofed and running a rig with many peoples lives at risk..come on..Just like you can't be pissed or coked up LOL..look at the concordia disaster!

BTW trevour nothing changed yesterday..
Except that the highest court agreed with what many of us have been saying for a long time that is : Since '96 when the constitution was enacted, peoples' basic human rights have been trodden over willy nilly style by State and its arms enforcing illegal legacy apartheid era lower laws that have no bearing in a young, modern and caring democratic nation.

It has been my right since '96, long before I started inbibing. It is now just recognised officially that is all and the highest court of the land has said "Enough!". Since yesterday. Everyone must now start, by law, acting accordingly. Officially. That's all folks. if you follow history the weed, or laws against it, have been used as an effective tool to bully and beat the minorities or masses in submission or in the case in the states to keep the privatized prison system full and profitable. But that time is drawing to a close. History has repeated itself enough times by now. The formerly persecuted all around the world are now forcing things to move on to new pastures through the same courts that were used to persecute them and it makes me smile as I recognize God's sense of humour.

Namaste.

:)

Last edited on Wed Sep 19th, 2018 10:14 am by Dr halibut hoffman

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Dr halibut hoffman wrote:
In workplace if you are on drugs in industries where safety is paramount, you'll get fired whether drug is legal or not..you can't as said rock up pissed.

Nothing has changed..In all law it must be proven..in contract, criminal, common etc..For proof you require a blood test. A piss test is and will only ever be an indication. Legal precedent has long been set in that regard. But ja you prove that they were recently enough stoned and they are fired.. Cant be goofed and running a rig with many peoples lives at risk..come on..Just like you can't be pissed or coked up LOL..look at the concordia disaster!

A

BTW trevour nothing changed yesterday..
Except that the highest court agreed with what many of us have been saying for a long time that is : Since '96 when the constitution was enacted, peoples' basic human rights have been trodden over willy nilly style by State and its arms enforcing illegal legacy apartheid era lower laws that have no bearing in a young, modern and caring democratic nation.

It has been my right since '96, long before I started inbibing. It is now just recognised officially that is all. Since yesterday. Everyone must now start, by law, acting accordingly. Officially. That's all folks. if you follow history the weed, or laws against it, have been used as an effective tool to bully and beat the minorities or masses in submission or in the case in the states to keep the privatized prison system full and profitable. But that time is drawing to a close. History has repeated itself enough times by now. The formerly persecuted all around the world are now forcing things to move on to new pastures through the same courts that were used to persecute them and it makes me smile as I recognize God's sense of humour.

Namaste.

:)


Amen my bra... however the company that I work for now (French) are not into testing... but if they catch you or you make a F UP... they will test you and you will be gone (Referring to naturals only.... Frenchies loves their "skyf")

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Ja it is the same like everything else now..Don't make a d00s of yourself and don't go make other peoples lives unpleasant and you deserve to be left in peace like me sitting in my lounge and having a beer. Same like if I am fishing and some guy cracks a beer next me and has a cold sundowner, I am not going phone him in for drinking on the beach. If he is being respectful and I will do the same. That said you can't go and get smashed pissed in public and make a nuisance of yourself and take your clothes off and run around like a bull in a china shop.. You will be locked up for causing k@k and rightly so. That all said, if I am sitting on the rocks quietly on a sunday afternoon by myself bothering no-one, with a spliff in hand, waiting for a bite, let me be..Don't unleash the dragon unnecessarily, treat me with the same respect I have already afforded those around me. Treat me with disrespect, like in all other areas of life, and you will be pushed right back over the line.

Reading the judgement, in fact Deputy Chief Justice Zondo specifically makes light of the above saying that the right to privacy extends to no only in your home but within your private personal space of your mind where you are in peace. He specifically recognizes in word the "right to be left alone in peace" if you are bothering no one wherever you are and have a right to be. Your right to privacy extends to that at least, and more. It is nice to have some of the basic civility that has been missing from our society recognized by our most powerful legal minds, and laid down in stone.

That is great as it also is precedent setting in other activities of mine where I go pick edible mushrooms legally (one of my winter protein sources and thoroughly checked the law out with lawyers who also are partial to creamed bacon or geelbek and porcici pasta) and so I get harrassed on public land by private employees of logging companies and I have put a stop to it though with threats of legal action from my side and playing their bluff of threat of arrest..but now precedent has been set, they do not even as I claimed have a right to bother me all or even speak to me if I wish not to speak to them, nevermind physically harrassing me which they have attempted..Buts cool like, advocates and lawyers like porcini's too so I got backup..heavy artillery like..bang..snoop dawg!

Ja been to france many times and the frenchies do love their cabbage..Their french islands hold special and world famous variaties of cabbage..

Last edited on Thu Sep 20th, 2018 10:52 am by Dr halibut hoffman

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Dr halibut hoffman wrote:
Ja it is the same like everything else now..Don't make a d00s of yourself and don't go make other peoples lives unpleasant and you deserve to be left in peace like me sitting in my lounge and having a beer. Same like if I am fishing and some guy cracks a beer next me and has a cold sundowner, I am not going phone him in for drinking on the beach. If he is being respectful and I will do the same. That said you can't go and get smashed pissed in public and make a nuisance of yourself and take your clothes off and run around like a bull in a china shop.. You will be locked up for causing k@k and rightly so. That all said, if I am sitting on the rocks quietly on a sunday afternoon by myself bothering no-one, with a spliff in hand, waiting for a bite, let me be..Don't unleash the dragon unnecessarily, treat me with the same respect I have already afforded those around me. Treat me with disrespect, like in all other areas of life, and you will be pushed right back over the line.

Ja been to france many times and the frenchies do love their cabbage..Their french islands hold special and world famous variaties of cabbage..



Agreed 1000%, see I think that is why they are "soft" on cabbage here, as back home it's not a major issue, as long as the work continues in a 'safe + sound' type thing.

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Once the frenchies accept you also, been to france many times, you will see a respectful and peaceful society that would be a whole new world to us..But our forefathers that made our constitution foresaw that world and wanted to take us there..

I mean not that I've done it for years, but if i take a stroll down field and pick a shroom and eat it and go home and trip and bother no-one and get arrested..It would too end up in court until the highest court where it would get chucked out and too would get recognized as my right and I would force others to let me be..but ja I would not need to as those cases are before the courts as we speak..great times to be in SA, took me by surprise..I thought it would still take a few months more..

You see it goes like this..today you are telling me what to think and to do..tomorrow you are telling me what to believe and who to follow..the next day you are telling me where to stand and where I can stay..the next morning, s#it we all woke up in a fascist state, what happened?!..It has happened time and again..It all starts with an erosion of personal rights. We were the first country in the world to enact dagga laws and they were for entirely that reason to clear the town squares of the "dagga smoking blacks". The fact that some were smoking dagga was a convenient excuse to round them up. This worked so well in fact that the governors in the racist American south used it as an example and enacted the second dagga laws in the world. This is a well documented part of history..You can look it up if you want. In fact it is included in court documents in cases before the courts here too.

Dagga cannot be used to bully people anymore..convenient for the rokers, and less so for the bullies. That is the point of a justice system and whereas for years the enforcement of illegal laws just created contempt for laws and law enforcement in general, and wasted resources, for now the rule and respect of law has been returned. And a start has been made with regards to the masses trusting that the law is on their side. The law enforcement will have to do much work in this regard to once again restore our trust in them after acting illegally for the last 22 years and completely breaking down all forms of trust with large swathes of the population locking them up, destroying lives and breaking up families all in the name of a plant. I mean young men got thrown in jail for a joint and got raped in cells, all because the state and its arms were claiming a right to "protect them from harm" and from a drug less harmful than legally sanctioned and taxed drugs..that situation of madness that was prevailing before yesterdays recognition of which law actually takes precedence and what is legal, was pretty fucked up in a civil society one has to admit.

Great day to be a Saffa..I don't think the clouds have yet lifted, except in the maritime and other industries where safety is paramount and the day off is over..;)

Sanity has prevailed, which it has not done for a long time in country..I thank the LORD!

Last edited on Wed Sep 19th, 2018 11:38 am by Dr halibut hoffman

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Dr halibut hoffman wrote:
In workplace if you are on drugs in industries where safety is paramount, you'll get fired whether drug is legal or not..you can't as said rock up pissed.

Nothing has changed..In all law it must be proven..in contract, criminal, common etc..For proof you require a blood test. A piss test is and will only ever be an indication. Legal precedent has long been set in that regard. But ja you prove that they were recently enough stoned and they are fired.. Cant be goofed and running a rig with many peoples lives at risk..come on..Just like you can't be pissed or coked up LOL..look at the concordia disaster!

BTW trevour nothing changed yesterday..
Except that the highest court agreed with what many of us have been saying for a long time that is : Since '96 when the constitution was enacted, peoples' basic human rights have been trodden over willy nilly style by State and its arms enforcing illegal legacy apartheid era lower laws that have no bearing in a young, modern and caring democratic nation.

It has been my right since '96, long before I started inbibing. It is now just recognised officially that is all and the highest court of the land has said "Enough!". Since yesterday. Everyone must now start, by law, acting accordingly. Officially. That's all folks. if you follow history the weed, or laws against it, have been used as an effective tool to bully and beat the minorities or masses in submission or in the case in the states to keep the privatized prison system full and profitable. But that time is drawing to a close. History has repeated itself enough times by now. The formerly persecuted all around the world are now forcing things to move on to new pastures through the same courts that were used to persecute them and it makes me smile as I recognize God's sense of humour.

Namaste.

:)


I agree 100% with your comments here.

Growing up my father ran a construction company and the daily ritual before work and at lunch time by his workers was to partake in large amounts of the herb. Those guys worked like demons and almost every construction project undertaken was finished way ahead of time.

Now should my wife or child require surgery and i know that the surgeon is a pothead. Mate i'm going to be looking for another surgeon.

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BUSINESS INSIDER | YOUR CAREER
Smoking dagga is being decriminalised, but you can still be fired for it – maybe????

# 1 - The Constitutional Court has ordered the decriminalisation of dagga for personal use – but that doesn't mean you can't be fired for using cannabis.

# 2 - Policies on inebriation are still in force, and in some jobs a legal requirement, even though they'll need to be adjusted.

# 3 - Things will be particularly complicated over the next two years, while changes are made to legislation.


========================================================

Smoking dagga can still get you fired, under the right circumstances. And staying away from cannabis – at least just before you go to work – could still be a legitimate requirement for some jobs.

But things got a whole lot more complicated after the Constitutional Court on Tuesday said the use of dagga is not a criminal act.

And during the two-year period the ConCourt gave Parliament to bring legislation in line with the Constitution, things are going to be particularly difficult when it comes to people getting high on the job, experts say.

"This is a curveball," Richard Malkin, managing director of company wellness provider Workforce Healthcare, told Business Insider South Africa after the Concourt judgment, even if, ultimately, "nothing is really going to change from a workplace perspective."

Occupational health and safety rules demand that companies keep the workplace safe, and that includes making sure nobody operates dangerous machines while inebriated – whatever the substance of choice.

For jobs involving heavy machinery, Malkin says, policy should require employees to disclose, up front, if they are using tranquillisers, for instance, even if under the direction of a doctor.

"The requirement is that you can't be under the influence of any mind-altering substance; whether it is legal or illegal doesn't really come into play."

Jobs in finance, or customer-facing jobs such as call centre agents advising customers, should also come with policies on inebriation.

But testing for dagga use is not as straight-forward as a breathalyser test for alcohol. The common, cheap, and fast urine test for cannabis actually detects a metabolic product that can linger for days – well after the user is no longer mentally affected.

So what happens if that test shows dagga use, and you tell the boss you smoked dagga days before? Right now, at least, Malkin believes the only thing a company could do is ask for a spectrophotometric test, which takes around two days and costs around R2,000.

In the meantime, the employee will have to be temporarily suspended from sensitive duties, as a precaution.

The result of such a test could be grounds for dismissal, speculate labour specialists who were still studying the ConCourt ruling, on the basis of dishonesty. Using dagga may not be a firing offence, but lying about it could be.

First, though, there could be a considerable fight about the whole process.

"Someone may have okayed drug testing by a company in a contract, but now that company can no longer look at THC [the active ingredient in cannabis]," says Quintin van Kerken, of The Clear Option, an organisation that works in the cannabis and addiction-treatment industry.

"It is pointless, because THC now falls under your right to privacy, so they can't do anything with a THC test."

Van Kerken believes there will be test cases about cannabis intoxication and medicinal use of cannabis in the workplace – perhaps soon – but until then there will be considerable confusion about the matter.

In the meanwhile, employees and employers both had better look at the exact wording of policies around drugs and inebriation at work, because a blanket reference to "alcohol, illegal drugs, and prescription medication", such as those now commonly found, don't strictly apply do dagga anymore.

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MichaelK wrote:
Dr halibut hoffman wrote:
In workplace if you are on drugs in industries where safety is paramount, you'll get fired whether drug is legal or not..you can't as said rock up pissed.

Nothing has changed..In all law it must be proven..in contract, criminal, common etc..For proof you require a blood test. A piss test is and will only ever be an indication. Legal precedent has long been set in that regard. But ja you prove that they were recently enough stoned and they are fired.. Cant be goofed and running a rig with many peoples lives at risk..come on..Just like you can't be pissed or coked up LOL..look at the concordia disaster!

BTW trevour nothing changed yesterday..
Except that the highest court agreed with what many of us have been saying for a long time that is : Since '96 when the constitution was enacted, peoples' basic human rights have been trodden over willy nilly style by State and its arms enforcing illegal legacy apartheid era lower laws that have no bearing in a young, modern and caring democratic nation.

It has been my right since '96, long before I started inbibing. It is now just recognised officially that is all and the highest court of the land has said "Enough!". Since yesterday. Everyone must now start, by law, acting accordingly. Officially. That's all folks. if you follow history the weed, or laws against it, have been used as an effective tool to bully and beat the minorities or masses in submission or in the case in the states to keep the privatized prison system full and profitable. But that time is drawing to a close. History has repeated itself enough times by now. The formerly persecuted all around the world are now forcing things to move on to new pastures through the same courts that were used to persecute them and it makes me smile as I recognize God's sense of humour.

Namaste.

:)


I agree 100% with your comments here.

Growing up my father ran a construction company and the daily ritual before work and at lunch time by his workers was to partake in large amounts of the herb. Those guys worked like demons and almost every construction project undertaken was finished way ahead of time.

Now should my wife or child require surgery and i know that the surgeon is a pothead. Mate i'm going to be looking for another surgeon.



LOL... agree 100% on the Surgeon, perhaps I am biased on some positions / jobs.... say your kids are in a lift club etc.... and one of the drivers (perfect safe driver) indulge in the herb or is known to, well of course one can imagine the reaction by the parents involved in the lift club...

Last edited on Thu Sep 20th, 2018 03:27 am by Serra Moz

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Battle won, but war not over to get full legislation, says 'Dagga Couple'

Cape Town - The “Dagga Couple” have set their sights on a mass class action against the state, to free those who have criminal records for the possession of dagga.
This follows the Constitutional Court’s landmark judgment on Tuesday declaring the private use and cultivation of dagga legal.

Myrtle Clarke and Jules Stobbs are in the process of creating a database to bring the class action in future. Clarke told the Cape Times that their war was far from over.

“We will keep fighting for everybody. The battle has been won, the war is not over. The war is to get complete legalisation, so all citizens can benefit economically,” she said.

“This ruling also doesn’t deal with criminal records, people in prison or stay of prosecution cases that have been put on hold pending this outcome.”


Clarke said the worst-affected were young people looking for jobs, possibly wanting to travel.

Advocate Rodney de Kock, the Director of Public Prosecutions in the Western Cape, said: “The ruling is prospective, which means it does not apply to cases that were in the criminal justice system already.

"At the time of the decision of the Western Cape High Court, a decision was taken not to enrol those cases which met the qualifying criteria – that is a small amount of cannabis for personal private consumption,” he said.

He said prosecutors would exercise their discretion and allow those cases that were provisionally withdrawn pending the Concourt decision to be closed without further prosecution.

“With regard to applications for records to be expunged if there are any such applications, each will be dealt with on its own merits,” De Kock said.

Meanwhile, Jeremy Acton from the Dagga Party said if they attained enough power in the 2019 elections, “we will wipe all records” in this regard.

“We want to write the law. We want for ourselves, legalising the plant completely, but it has to happen in Parliament,” said Acton.

“The ruling is great. It allows people to get access to this medicine, it creates a private community-based economy and keeps it away from corporations. We have to get to Parliament so it cannot be sold out to corporates.”

The couple called on all those affected to submit their details to http://www.Fieldsofgreenforall.org.za

The contact form can be found on their “Jointheq” tab.

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Those wheels are turning..

Spoke to my lawyer who was there in the court for the historic occasion..elation all round..once he is finished with the huge work load we will join up for a legal fatty..on the weekend out of worktime ;)

F'king great world to be in..everywhere i go people have their plants in the ground already! This end of summer is going to be one everyone forgets ever happened..Ey victory never tasted so sweet LOL

Last edited on Thu Sep 20th, 2018 10:14 am by Dr halibut hoffman

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Dr halibut hoffman wrote:
Those wheels are turning..

Spoke to my lawyer who was there in the court for the historic occasion..elation all round..once he is finished with the huge work load we will join up for a legal fatty..on the weekend out of worktime ;)

F'king great world to be in..everywhere i go people have their plants in the ground already! This end of summer is going to be one everyone forgets ever happened..Ey victory never tasted so sweet LOL


hehehehe, true - whilst they sort out the "finer shite" at least the okes can now cool off in their own houses and like you said, 'display' their plants..

Sadly where I reside, highly illegal, specially if you are a muzungu...hmmfff, yet it's the port of entry of all types of drugs..

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Why the ConCourt decision to legalise dagga for private use is a good thing

South Africa’s Constitutional Court has passed down a judgment that makes it legal for adults to cultivate and smoke marijuana in their homes. The court – the country’s highest – ruled that the right to privacy was violated by prohibiting the possession, purchase or cultivation of cannabis for personal consumption by an adult in a private dwelling.

The case was pursued by various parties, including a Cape Town lawyer, Gareth Prince, who is a practising Rastafarian. It was opposed by, among others, the country’s ministers of Justice and Constitutional Development, Police and Health; the country’s National Director of Public Prosecutions and the NGO Doctors for Life International.

The Constitutional Court’s judgment is to be applauded for doing away with the moralistic and paternalistic assumption that marijuana use by adults in private is always wrong and unhealthy. South Africa joins a number of countries that have taken a similar step, among them Canada and Portugal.

But there are still lots of uncertainties that need to be cleared up before South Africans can use marijuana without fear of prosecution. One of these is that the country’s laws will have to be brought into line with the judgment.

What the court found

In making its ruling, the Constitutional Court considered several issues. These included privacy, health concerns and the status quo in other parts of the world.

Delivering the unanimous judgment, Deputy Chief Justice Raymond Zondo stated that “the right to privacy entitles an adult person to use or cultivate or possess cannabis in private for his or her personal consumption”. And, he added,

to the extent that the impugned provisions criminalise such cultivation, possession or use of cannabis, they limit the right to privacy.

The court also examined the medical evidence that was used when the case was first brought to a lower court – the Western Cape High Court – as well as evidence from a 2002 case about the religious use of marijuana. It found no persuasive medical evidence that dagga in small amounts was harmful to users, particularly compared to the harm resulting from use of alcohol. Nor was there proof that marijuana use caused violent or aggressive behaviour or that its use led to the use of more potent or dangerous drugs.

The Constitutional Court noted that the personal consumption of small quantities of marijuana had been decriminalised or legalised in many other democratic countries.

The State failed to prove that the existing limitation of privacy was reasonable and justifiable. The relevant legal provisions that criminalise personal, private use of dagga by adults were declared unconstitutional and invalid. That order was suspended for 24 months. This will give parliament time to rectify the constitutional defects.

In the interim, the court ordered, adults who use, possess or cultivate cannabis in private for their own personal consumption are not guilty of contravening these provisions.

The personal consumption exception has been widely celebrated. But it raises various practical difficulties.

Practical concerns

First, it’s less than clear under what circumstances the personal consumption exception will apply. According to the Constitutional Court, police officers will have to determine this on a case by case basis. To do so, they’ll need to consider factors such as the quantity of cannabis in the person’s possession and whether they can give a satisfactory account of their possession.

Uncertainty relating to how the exception is to be enforced in practice is problematic. It may even mean that the exception violates the so-called principle of fair warning. This rule requires criminal law provisions to be clearly formulated so those subject to them know ahead of time what they may and may not do.

Second, while the Constitutional Court judgment confirms the Western Cape High Court’s findings in many respects, it also differs in important ways. Significantly, the Constitutional Court held that there was no persuasive reason for the High Court to confine its declaration of invalidity to marijuana use in a home or private dwelling.

The Constitutional Court envisages instead that, provided dagga is used “in private and not in public”, it is protected by the right to privacy, even if the adult in question is not at home or in a private dwelling. It uses the example of someone who has cannabis in their pocket for private consumption, and then steps outside their home or dwelling. Provided the cannabis remains in their pocket and is for personal use, it still falls within the constitutional protection.

This seemingly broadens the exception proposed by the High Court. But once again, it remains to be seen how the courts will interpret the distinction between public and private use in practice.

Another aspect of the High Court judgment the Constitutional Court refused to confirm relates to the order declaring that provisions prohibiting the purchase of cannabis were invalid. The Constitutional Court argued that allowing people to purchase marijuana would amount to sanctioning dealing in cannabis.

This aspect of the judgment raises a legitimate practical concern: how is an adult user of cannabis supposed to acquire the marijuana they’re allowed to use in private if they don’t buy it from a dealer of some sort (which the Constitutional Court explicitly says is illegal)?

The user could grow their own. But they would need to obtain the seeds or buy them from someone else – who is, by definition, a dealer. The judgment’s implication seems to be that to exercise one’s (constitutionally-protected) right to use marijuana in private, one must inevitably act illegally since any purchase of marijuana and related products makes one an accomplice to dealing in cannabis.

* Mary Nel is a senior lecturer in Public Law at Stellenbosch University.

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In any case they don’t have the savvy and the gumption to catch and prosecute the dealer.
Years back the magistrate threw my case out the court - possession of 250grams
What the f@@k she said this is wasting my time

👊🏻😎

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Psy wrote:
In any case they don’t have the savvy and the gumption to catch and prosecute the dealer.
Years back the magistrate threw my case out the court - possession of 250grams
What the f@@k she said this is wasting my time

👊🏻😎



LOL...same same in Durban circa 92, appeared once, and was told they don't have time to waste on debating a "bankie"... They have more important cases going about, however... at that time all the KZN political killings were the flavours of the day, so perhaps very lucky thatday??, I can understand as they brought about 15 gents shackled to the 10s! Super armed cops etc...Maybe just my luck? In KZN, I know about lots of cases that did not even make it to the courts, of course not referring to a taxi load of "skyf"... but you average stop of 5, few pencils here and there, and a "bankie" or 2....

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https://www.iol.co.za/news/opinion/braaivleis-rugby-sunny-skies-and-dagga-17186106
Braaivleis, rugby, sunny skies and... dagga


Thanks a bunch, Your Honours, but now that I can use dagga in private, there’s no fun in it any more. The thrill of the illicit has gone and my devil-worshipping has been reduced to mere gesture, a ritual void of meaning.

I jest, of course. It is only the delusional who truck with Satan these days, and they were out in force following the Constitutional Court’s ruling, muttering darkly of the legislative crisis, mental breakdowns and social upheavals lurking in the offing.

We are a terrified nation, it seems, and there was much hysteria on the talk shows as callers blathered on fearfully about children whose parents would now take to cannabis like lemmings, stoned drivers on the roads and, laughably, asset managers not exercising due fiduciary prudence with their clients’ investments.

More soberly, the response from most of the political parties was guardedly neutral. Worryingly, there was talk of “responsible” adult use, which reeked of apartheid’s joyless Calvinism.

Seriously, how do you get responsibly stoned, and is it any fun? The whole point of being off your face is that you regress to adolescence: your brain melts, you eat peanut butter cookies and you giggle at silly videos on YouTube.

Besides, was there concerned prattle of responsible buggery when sodomy was legalised? No, I don’t think so either.

The lunatic fringe also had their two cents’ worth.

Like many others, Bheki Cele, the funny police minister, hauled out the tired propaganda about marijuana being a gateway drug. If anything, research suggests that coffee’s more likely to lead to harder drugs than any other substance.

Still, cannabis remains the gateway trigger with the botherers and hard of thinking; one mention of dagga, and they’re off, immediately churning out heroin horror stories.

According to the Citizen newspaper, Cele also claimed that, had Deputy Chief Justice Raymond Zondo consulted with him, well, marijuana users would all still be breaking the law and liable for prosecution.

Whatever Cele had been smoking, it certainly wasn’t dagga.

Needless to say, the Mahogany Ridge stoners welcome the court’s decision. As it is, we wouldn’t have stopped doing dagga had the judges ruled otherwise, and this is true of the millions of South Africans who regularly use the drug.

The ruling is certainly apposite, this being Heritage Month and what-what. Is anything more Saffer than home-grown? Like braaivleis and rugby, weed is more likely to get the nation to socially cohere than Arts and Culture Minister Nathi Mthethwa’s ugly “I Am The Flag” campaign.

We may be (stifled yawn) a young democracy, but it’s been a part of our culture for centuries. João dos Santos, the Portuguese missionary who rounded the Cape in 1586, noted that cannabis was grown here and the locals ate it to get stoned.

It was the Dutch who later taught them to smoke, and the practice was more or less tolerated for the next 250 years.

It was only with the coming of sugar - which, as it turns out, is a way more harmful and addictive substance - that prohibition began in earnest as concerns rose that a mellow and stoned labour pool would negatively impact on profits.

There is some irony here. As part of the worldwide movement away from sugar, one of the world’s major pushers of the stuff, Coca-Cola, is now considering a soft drink product containing cannabidiol, a marijuana extract that has calming, analgesic properties.

Admittedly, cannabidiol has no psychoactive effects. But that’s okay. We throw brandy in our Coke, which brings something deranged to the table.

But, bottom line, there’s a lot of tom in dagga. Parliament has two years in which to frame up new laws, legalising the whole caboodle - from tourist-friendly Amsterdam-style cafés to the industrial park-sized medical marijuana-growing facilities - will surely wrest major revenue from the black markets.

For all the dope, it really is a no-brainer.

* The views expressed here are not necessarily those of Independent Media.

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On the labour law.. This written before the appeal lost by the state but post the high court judgement...

https://www.labourguide.co.za/latest-news-1/2455-flying-high-weed-in-the-workplace

Flying high – Weed in the workplace

By Jose Jorge, Director and Steven Adams, Associate, Employment, Cliffe Dekker Hofmeyr



In the last few weeks, several news outlets have suggested that the use of cannabis is now legal. Before employees are emboldened to light up, it’s important to note that this isn’t what the High Court found.



In Prince v Minister of Justice and Constitutional Development and Others [2017] ZAWCHC 30, the Western Cape High Court reasoned that the “blunt” instrument of criminal law as employed under the current legislation is disproportionate to the harms that the legislation seeks to curb insofar as the personal use and consumption of cannabis is concerned.



The Court declared parts of the Drugs and Drug Trafficking Act, No 140 of 1992 and the Medicines and Related Substances Control Act, No 101 of 1965 inconsistent with the Constitution to the extent that they encroach upon private use and consumption of cannabis for personal purposes. The Court suspended its declaration of invalidity for two years to allow Parliament to correct the defects in the legislation.



If Parliament amends the relevant legislation to give effect to the Prince judgment, employers may have to reconsider how, in the workplace, they deal with the effects of personal cannabis use.



Most employers have policies dealing with alcohol and drug abuse. Depending on the industry and the nature of the employees’ duties, the employer’s approach to alcohol abuse and the sanction imposed may vary. Employers, however, generally adopt a zero-tolerance approach to the use of illegal drugs.



Testing for alcohol is relatively easy. Breathalysers, although not uncontroversial, provide an efficient and quick means to estimate blood alcohol levels through the analysis of a person’s breath. This allows an employer a fairly accurate view of the probable physical and mental impairment of the employee based on the blood alcohol concentration.



If the personal use of cannabis is legalised, it is likely that employees who previously feared the legal consequences of partaking may now do so. This may lead to an increasing focus on cannabis use and its impact on the workplace.



There are a number of ways to test for cannabis. These include urine, hair and blood analysis. Traces of cannabis can be detected for up to 10 days to six months after use. In contrast, alcohol may leave the bloodstream within hours after consumption.



Unlike alcohol, the effects of cannabis on an employee’s ability to perform his or her duties are less well known and the tests are likely to be more complicated and time-consuming. It appears that the tests for cannabis also cannot accurately determine the degree of impairment of the employee to do his or her job.



A more nuanced approached in the workplace will be required for dealing with the use of cannabis than that for alcohol. An employee that has a “drag” in the morning before coming to work may be able to function optimally at work even though technically they may be under the influence. An employee that legally used cannabis on a Friday evening is likely to show traces of the drug if tested at work on a Monday, even though no longer under the influence, and unlikely to be impaired.



As is apparent from the examples provided above, it may be difficult for an employer to justify a dismissal in such circumstances. While an employer may prohibit cannabis use while at work, it would be difficult to police the legal use of a drug that may or may not have an effect in the workplace.



As with alcohol abuse, an employer may take disciplinary action against an employee, without a test, where the effects of cannabis are clearly observable and it is clear that the employee is too impaired to do their job or are a risk to other employees in the workplace.



Any policy aimed at addressing specifically the use of cannabis and its effects in the workplace, would have to take into account factors such as consent to testing for cannabis, the manner of testing, the nature of the employer’s business, the employee’s duties, the circumstances in which the offence was committed, the observable extent of the impairment, and the employee’s history of cannabis or other drug-related offences at work.



Whatever test an employer decides to apply it must comply with s7 of the Employment Equity Act, No 55 of 1998. In terms of s7, the test must be permitted or required by law, or must be justifiable in light of medical facts, employment conditions, social policy, the fair distribution of employee benefits or the inherent requirements of a job. Any employer wishing to institute random testing for cannabis would have to ensure that the testing is voluntary, confidential and not motivated by victimisation or unfair discrimination.



Employers should be careful to distinguish between misconduct and incapacity when it comes to cannabis use. Where an employee can show an addiction to cannabis, the employer will have to consider whether counselling and rehabilitation may be appropriate steps. This would require that the employer provide assistance to the employee in terms of item 10(3) of the Code of Good Practice: Dismissals.



The fact that cannabis may in future be used by an employee at home does necessarily mean that the employee is entitled to come to work under the influence or with his or her ability to work impaired. The employee is still required to adhere to the employer’s workplace rules and policies. The difficulty employers will face with employees using cannabis is the complexities around proving that an employee’s ability to work was impaired or that the employee was under the under the influence whilst at work.



The Occupational Health and Safety implications of the Prince judgment will be addressed in another alert by Fiona Leppan, a Director in our Employment law practice area.



For more information contact Jose Jorge at or Steven Adams at

Article published with the kind courtesy of Cliffe Dekker Hofmeyr http://www.cliffedekkerhofmeyr.com

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And post the appeal, popular articles on the same..Pretty much what was said here..

https://www.businessinsider.co.za/dagga-concourt-ruling-immediately-impacts-cannabis-testing-at-work-for-thc-2018-9

The Constitutional Court has ordered the decriminalisation of dagga for personal use – but that doesn't mean you can't be fired for using cannabis.
Policies on inebriation are still in force, and in some jobs a legal requirement, even though they'll need to be adjusted.
Things will be particularly complicated over the next two years, while changes are made to legislation.

Smoking dagga can still get you fired, under the right circumstances. And staying away from cannabis – at least just before you go to work – could still be a legitimate requirement for some jobs.

But things got a whole lot more complicated after the Constitutional Court on Tuesday said the use of dagga is not a criminal act.

And during the two-year period the ConCourt gave Parliament to bring legislation in line with the Constitution, things are going to be particularly difficult when it comes to people getting high on the job, experts say.
See also: We took a scientific look at whether dagga or alcohol is worse for you — and there appears to be a winner

"This is a curveball," Richard Malkin, managing director of company wellness provider Workforce Healthcare, told Business Insider South Africa after the Concourt judgment, even if, ultimately, "nothing is really going to change from a workplace perspective."

Occupational health and safety rules demand that companies keep the workplace safe, and that includes making sure nobody operates dangerous machines while inebriated – whatever the substance of choice.

For jobs involving heavy machinery, Malkin says, policy should require employees to disclose, up front, if they are using tranquillisers, for instance, even if under the direction of a doctor.

"The requirement is that you can't be under the influence of any mind-altering substance; whether it is legal or illegal doesn't really come into play."

Jobs in finance, or customer-facing jobs such as call centre agents advising customers, should also come with policies on inebriation.

But testing for dagga use is not as straight-forward as a breathalyser test for alcohol. The common, cheap, and fast urine test for cannabis actually detects a metabolic product that can linger for days – well after the user is no longer mentally affected.

So what happens if that test shows dagga use, and you tell the boss you smoked dagga days before? Right now, at least, Malkin believes the only thing a company could do is ask for a spectrophotometric test, which takes around two days and costs around R2,000.

In the meantime, the employee will have to be temporarily suspended from sensitive duties, as a precaution.

The result of such a test could be grounds for dismissal, speculate labour specialists who were still studying the ConCourt ruling, on the basis of dishonesty. Using dagga may not be a firing offence, but lying about it could be.

First, though, there could be a considerable fight about the whole process.

"Someone may have okayed drug testing by a company in a contract, but now that company can no longer look at THC [the active ingredient in cannabis]," says Quintin van Kerken, of The Clear Option, an organisation that works in the cannabis and addiction-treatment industry.

"It is pointless, because THC now falls under your right to privacy, so they can't do anything with a THC test."

Van Kerken believes there will be test cases about cannabis intoxication and medicinal use of cannabis in the workplace – perhaps soon – but until then there will be considerable confusion about the matter.

In the meanwhile, employees and employers both had better look at the exact wording of policies around drugs and inebriation at work, because a blanket reference to "alcohol, illegal drugs, and prescription medication", such as those now commonly found, don't strictly apply do dagga anymore.

Probably.

Dr halibut hoffman
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And more..and pretty much what was said here..and I especially love all the judgement that was handed down regarding the right to privacy, which believe me will have more far reaching concequences in the future on everyones' lives in SA than the dope will..

"The judgment also deliberated extensively to the right to privacy, citing numerous arguments in previous cases, but Judge Zondo summarised it appropriately as the right to be left alone."

I am a private person and have always maintain that I have the "right to be left alone" if bothering no-one. This is how nature works and through obvious natural law could always be forced through the courts but the fact that it has now been recognized by the highest court in that manner means that one does not need to go that avenue..it is a brave new world ahead and with those in power on this planet clamoring to have the superior A 'aye to rule us all. This is a major victory in SA. Things like warrantless electronic surveillance, rica, fica, android and its parent, spacebook. smart phone surveillance, city wide and transport network surveillance, national voice print databases..etc.. could all now be sliced and diced in court in a simple manner due to this precedent when it gets to that as it is now obvious that those things are wholly unconstitutional and clearly illegally implemented in South Africa.. ;)

http://www.bizcommunity.com/Article/196/548/182101.html

Stoned staff? What are employers' rights regarding weed in the workplace?

By: Rudy D Maritz

The ban on private possession, consumption and private cultivation of marijuana at home was ruled unconstitutional by the Constitutional Court on 18 September 2018, effectively decriminalising both the use and cultivation of dagga in private. What, however, does this mean for employers, and what should they do next?
Stoned staff? What are employers' rights regarding weed in the workplace?
© luis carlos jimenez del rio – 123RF.com
Deputy chief justice Raymond Zondo, more often found recently probing alleged state capture at the commission of inquiry he helms, delivered the unanimous judgment.

The court not only upheld but expanded on Dennis Davis’ landmark judgment last year that adults using and growing marijuana in the privacy of their own home should be left in peace.

In addition to this, parliament has been given two years to change sections of both the drug trafficking act and the medicine controls act after these sections were found constitutionally invalid.

ConCourt rules to decriminalise the personal use of marijuana
ConCourt rules to decriminalise the personal use of marijuana

NEWSWATCH: The Constitutional Court's landmark judgment that every pot-smoker across South Africa has been waiting for since the Cape High Court ruled in favour of decriminalising the use of marijuana, has been made...

18 Sep 2018


The ConCourt confirmed the ruling of the Western Cape High Court in part and added that the references to “in a private dwelling” or “in private dwellings” is replaced with “in private” or in the case of cultivation, “in a private place.” This is a very significant change as it no longer restricts the use and possession to the inside of a dwelling, but also includes a vehicle or on one’s person, even your carry-on luggage at the airport.

The court ruled that sections 4(b) of the Drugs and Drug Trafficking Act 140 of 1992 read with Part III of Schedule 2 of that Act and the provisions of section 22A(9)(a)(i) of the Medicines and Related Substances Control Act 101 of 1965 read with Schedule 7 of GN R509 of 2003 published in terms of section 22A(2) of that Act are inconsistent with right to privacy entrenched in section 14 of the Constitution to the extent that the use or possession of cannabis in private by an adult person for his or her own consumption in private is not a criminal offence.

The court also did not specify any quantity restrictions.

While parliament will take up to 24 months to adapt the law to reflect all these changes, Justice Zondo explained that individuals are allowed to smoke privately in their own home in the meanwhile.

Zondo also stressed that both selling the substance and use of it by minors is still illegal.

Employers may now face some challenges from cannabis-consuming employees and it imperative that the correct message is conveyed from the out-set.

What should be treated differently in lieu of the ConCourt ruling?

General Safety Regulation 2A(1) states that “Subject to the provisions of subregulation (3), an employer or a user, as the case may be, shall not permit any person who is or who appears to be under the influence of intoxicating liquor or drugs, to enter or remain at a workplace.

(2) Subject to the provisions of subregulation (3), no person at a workplace shall be under the influence of or have in his or her possession or partake of or offer any other person intoxicating liquor or drugs.

(3) An employer or a user, as the case may be, shall, in the case where a person is taking medicines, only allow such person to perform duties at the workplace if the side effects of such medicine do not constitute a threat to the health or safety of the person concerned or other persons at such workplace”.

Although the ConCourt’s order did not include changes to the OHS Act or the GSR, it does however have some serious implications.

Weed in the workplace

What do you do when an employee comes to work with cannabis in his or her pocket or handbag? It is “in private”. It is thus not illegal.

In the judgment (Order in “100”) Judge Zondo said: “It seems to me that, indeed, there was no persuasive reason why the High Court confined its declaration of invalidity to the use or possession or cultivation of cannabis at a home or in a private dwelling. In my view, as long as the use or possession of cannabis is in private and not in public and the use or possession of cannabis is for the personal consumption of an adult, it is protected. Therefore, provided the use or possession of cannabis is by an adult person in private for his or her personal consumption, it is protected by the right to privacy entrenched in section 14 of our Constitution.

Legalising marijuana would create a minefield in the workplace
Legalising marijuana would create a minefield in the workplace

As marijuana smokers await the ConCourt decision on whether or not the substance should be legalised, the matter casts a spotlight on the adequacy of company policies regarding substance abuse in the workplace...

8 Feb 2018


The judgment also deliberated extensively to the right to privacy, citing numerous arguments in previous cases, but Judge Zondo summarised it appropriately as the right to be left alone.

GSR 2A is in similar fashion thus also in part contrary to the ConCourt’s ruling although no ruling was made.

Here are my reasons for saying this:

The purpose of GSR 2(A) is to protect employees from injury (or injuring others) while under the influence of alcohol or drugs. In order to fulfil this purpose:
The employer may not allow a person who is or appears to intoxicated on the premises,
An employee may not work while intoxicated or use while at work, and
If under medication, the employer must consider the side affects and allow an employee to only do such tasks that would not pose a safety or health risk.

The purpose of GSR2(A) was extended to criminalise possession of alcohol or drugs in the phrase “have in his or her possession” in 2(A)2. It is important to note that possession is not illegal if solely for own use in private. And although a workplace toilet is private, the purpose of the regulation is to protect the employee and “use in private while at work” is still illegal.
It is only the part of the regulation referring to possession, which is contrary to the ConCourt ruling and it can also be extended to alcohol and other drugs.

The fact is that “possession” alone is not sufficient to enforce GSR2(A)2, and companies need to carefully evaluation their access control procedure. “Possession” may however be cause for concern for “under the influence.”

What should an employer do now?

In my opinion, given the extent of privacy argued by the ConCourt, employers need to re-evaluate their alcohol and drug abuse policies and procedures through a consultative process and since the “use in private of cannabis” is no longer illegal, encourage voluntary disclosure of such use. From there, an assessment can be made as to the extent of controls needed.

Cannabis remains detectable in the human system for up to 30 days, but the “intoxication” effects or short-term effects start to taper off after three or four hours. When marijuana is ingested, its effects peak between four and six hours.

The regulatory reference “appear to be under the influence” has often caused companies to “test and be sure” of intoxication but given the time lapse, one would never be 100% certain. One therefore needs to be extremely cautious not to subject an employee to undue corrective action in the interest of safety, where there are no legal grounds to do so.

Last edited on Sat Sep 22nd, 2018 01:36 pm by Dr halibut hoffman

Hooch
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If anyone want to join our Group called the The Cannabis Growers Club of Southern Africa on FB. Drop me a pm. You wont find it unless you are invited.:walk:D

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Hooch wrote:
If anyone want to join our Group called the The Cannabis Growers Club of Southern Africa on FB. Drop me a pm. You wont find it unless you are invited.:walk:D - Joined ages ago... just following... pity no "hash sellers"....LOL

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Grow your own mate and make it

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Hooch wrote:
Grow your own mate and make it

To get arrested??? Where I live??? Hmmmff not

willem wikkel spies
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the judgement is for personal use in the privacy of your own home, if im not mistaken.

go smoke the aaptwak at home and stay there and off the roads.
as easy as that.
oh ja, and do it away from your children!!!

the sad thing is, is that cannabis normally leads to other things stronger things!!!!

that is why it was always against the law to have it.

why everyone is raving about it is unknown.

luckily I do not smoke it or use it. so I cannot understand the hype about it.

so enjoy it while it lasts, maybe forever.

and, do not try and convince me otherwise, lol

Serra Moz
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willem wikkel spies wrote:
the judgement is for personal use in the privacy of your own home, if im not mistaken.

go smoke the aaptwak at home and stay there and off the roads.
as easy as that.
oh ja, and do it away from your children!!!

the sad thing is, is that cannabis normally leads to other things stronger things!!!!

that is why it was always against the law to have it.

why everyone is raving about it is unknown.

luckily I do not smoke it or use it. so I cannot understand the hype about it.

so enjoy it while it lasts, maybe forever.

and, do not try and convince me otherwise, lol



Sure in SA..... However I don't live in SA...

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willem wikkel spies wrote:
the judgement is for personal use in the privacy of your own home, if im not mistaken.

go smoke the aaptwak at home and stay there and off the roads.
as easy as that.
oh ja, and do it away from your children!!!

the sad thing is, is that cannabis normally leads to other things stronger things!!!!

that is why it was always against the law to have it.

why everyone is raving about it is unknown.

luckily I do not smoke it or use it. so I cannot understand the hype about it.

so enjoy it while it lasts, maybe forever.

and, do not try and convince me otherwise, lol


It's a bit like "each to his own, not so? No, and you are not correct in - I quote

(1)YOU SAID.... "that is why it was always against the law to have it.".....My reply = The laws....colonial laws back in the day made it illegal, it was used by the Boer Volkmen since Noah was an "Able Seaman" = smoked / tea / brew === Boere Raad for meds (We had some good chirps about that in the
family)

(2) YOU SAID... "go smoke the aaptwak at home and stay there and off the roads.
as easy as that."....MY REPLY = Yet to see a person that caused an accident thru weed??? - ONLY WEED, not a combo of weed / booze / chems

(3) YOU SAID...oh ja, and do it away from your children!!!.... MY REPLY = You might have a point I don't visit all households.... my kids don't care I suppose, well of course if the person is smoking "chems" yes not good... Mainly a "behind doors scene" I suppose.. BUT, on the flip side, it's OK then for you, when parents to get F'd out their minds on Brannas + Coke, Voddies + Sprite, or the "Wyn Vlieg aunties.... smoking tons of Dunhill + El Cheapo "Voyager" entjies???? Vloek "ma se P", or every 2nd word is the F word???... next to the braai?...

(4) YOU SAID.....the sad thing is, is that cannabis normally leads to other things stronger things!!!! - MY REPLY, "Myth buster"..... you are wrong again on that one.... that's the typical "Calvinistic brainwash dogma - that's brainwashed thousands / millions in SA..... the typical jargon used in sermons.... by a "sober" dominee - that after the Sunday's runnings will "gooi a dop" at the pastorie - curtains closed of course, and just maybe **** his wife too... So... smoking weed leads to hard core stuff.... I think booze destroys more people than drugs... as you can buy booze legally anytime of the day at any place or town??? Yes, I know you are referring to "hard core" drugs, but the "weed gateway" has been used as the scapegoat since the bible's 30th print.... not so?... Or when the fellow falls off the bus, and are forced in rehab, and he/she ran out of excuses... will use "oh ok... it was because of the zol"... Your typical "sunday school" excuse....LOL

(5)YOU SAID...why everyone is raving about it is unknown.

luckily I do not smoke it or use it. so I cannot understand the hype about it. - MY REPLY.... Not sure who is raving about it, most pot heads or proper herbal okes, did not give a F then - likewise now with the new law...."a luta continua" - meaning the struggle continues and life just goes on, nothing new, perhaps the "teeny bobbers" or "yuppies" that did it behind close doors, are falling out of the woodwork now, and Oh it's do so cool, and wow - great man... Good for you, that you don't smoke it... (again, each to his own... I enjoyed it since school and in the Army...LOL) AND AND ...

(6)YOU SAID...so enjoy it while it lasts, maybe forever.
MY REPLY.... No stress on that, it's here to stay... so it's forever...LOL


(7)YOU SAID....and, do not try and convince me otherwise, lol.... MY REPLY.... Nobody tried to convince you.... again, "each to his own"... Your opinion is based on your opinion and I respect that....

Last edited on Sun Apr 28th, 2019 12:55 am by Serra Moz

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willem wikkel spies wrote:
the judgement is for personal use in the privacy of your own home, if im not mistaken.

go smoke the aaptwak at home and stay there and off the roads.
as easy as that.
oh ja, and do it away from your children!!!

the sad thing is, is that cannabis normally leads to other things stronger things!!!!

that is why it was always against the law to have it.

why everyone is raving about it is unknown.

luckily I do not smoke it or use it. so I cannot understand the hype about it.

so enjoy it while it lasts, maybe forever.

and, do not try and convince me otherwise, lol


:shock:

The Medicinal properties of dagga alone should wake you up to its beneficial use.
I have personally seen friends of mine healed of cancer by the dagga oil.
Medically it cures Parkinson’s disease in adults, epilepsy in children, cancer in all forms.
The Medical teams in Canada are already marketing the use of dagga oil worldwide and South Africa and Lesotho are on their list of potential growers and investors.
The New York Stock exchange has acknowledged the potential of medicinal dagga oil as a potential source of wealth. It will soon become a common stock making probably more money than Oil.
Hemp clothing is already marketed on the streets as well as many beneficial uses to hemp seeds for your everyday vitality and health.

Instead of your one-sided blinkered small town approach that possibly your dominee taught you, suggest you study some... maybe take a puff or two....and pass it on?

Yes it will last forever .... that you can be sure of that.

;)

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Psy wrote:
willem wikkel spies wrote:
the judgement is for personal use in the privacy of your own home, if im not mistaken.

go smoke the aaptwak at home and stay there and off the roads.
as easy as that.
oh ja, and do it away from your children!!!

the sad thing is, is that cannabis normally leads to other things stronger things!!!!

that is why it was always against the law to have it.

why everyone is raving about it is unknown.

luckily I do not smoke it or use it. so I cannot understand the hype about it.

so enjoy it while it lasts, maybe forever.

and, do not try and convince me otherwise, lol


:shock:

The Medicinal properties of dagga alone should wake you up to its beneficial use.
I have personally seen friends of mine healed of cancer by the dagga oil.
Medically it cures Parkinson’s disease in adults, epilepsy in children, cancer in all forms.
The Medical teams in Canada are already marketing the use of dagga oil worldwide and South Africa and Lesotho are on their list of potential growers and investors.
The New York Stock exchange has acknowledged the potential of medicinal dagga oil as a potential source of wealth. It will soon become a common stock making probably more money than Oil.
Hemp clothing is already marketed on the streets as well as many beneficial uses to hemp seeds for your everyday vitality and health.

Instead of your one-sided blinkered small town approach that possibly your dominee taught you, suggest you study some... maybe take a puff or two....and pass it on?

Yes it will last forever .... that you can be sure of that.

;)



LOL..... That was in a "nutshell" PSY?

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https://www.energyandcapital.com/

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https://www.benzinga.com/money/marijuana-stocks/?amp

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Psy wrote:
willem wikkel spies wrote:
the judgement is for personal use in the privacy of your own home, if im not mistaken.

go smoke the aaptwak at home and stay there and off the roads.
as easy as that.
oh ja, and do it away from your children!!!

the sad thing is, is that cannabis normally leads to other things stronger things!!!!

that is why it was always against the law to have it.

why everyone is raving about it is unknown.

luckily I do not smoke it or use it. so I cannot understand the hype about it.

so enjoy it while it lasts, maybe forever.

and, do not try and convince me otherwise, lol


:shock:

The Medicinal properties of dagga alone should wake you up to its beneficial use.
I have personally seen friends of mine healed of cancer by the dagga oil.
Medically it cures Parkinson’s disease in adults, epilepsy in children, cancer in all forms.
The Medical teams in Canada are already marketing the use of dagga oil worldwide and South Africa and Lesotho are on their list of potential growers and investors.
The New York Stock exchange has acknowledged the potential of medicinal dagga oil as a potential source of wealth. It will soon become a common stock making probably more money than Oil.
Hemp clothing is already marketed on the streets as well as many beneficial uses to hemp seeds for your everyday vitality and health.

Instead of your one-sided blinkered small town approach that possibly your dominee taught you, suggest you study some... maybe take a puff or two....and pass it on?

Yes it will last forever .... that you can be sure of that.

;)

i do know the medicinal values of teh oil, tea etc.
yes it has proven to be w orth while drug in society.

but smoking weed puts you on a plak!!!!
so if you are a lorrie driver, driving 40 tons at top speeds, you not going to stop in time at teh traffic light!!!

then teh sh!t will hit the fan!!!

Psy
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willem wikkel spies wrote:
Psy wrote:
willem wikkel spies wrote:
the judgement is for personal use in the privacy of your own home, if im not mistaken.

go smoke the aaptwak at home and stay there and off the roads.
as easy as that.
oh ja, and do it away from your children!!!

the sad thing is, is that cannabis normally leads to other things stronger things!!!!

that is why it was always against the law to have it.

why everyone is raving about it is unknown.

luckily I do not smoke it or use it. so I cannot understand the hype about it.

so enjoy it while it lasts, maybe forever.

and, do not try and convince me otherwise, lol


:shock:

The Medicinal properties of dagga alone should wake you up to its beneficial use.
I have personally seen friends of mine healed of cancer by the dagga oil.
Medically it cures Parkinson’s disease in adults, epilepsy in children, cancer in all forms.
The Medical teams in Canada are already marketing the use of dagga oil worldwide and South Africa and Lesotho are on their list of potential growers and investors.
The New York Stock exchange has acknowledged the potential of medicinal dagga oil as a potential source of wealth. It will soon become a common stock making probably more money than Oil.
Hemp clothing is already marketed on the streets as well as many beneficial uses to hemp seeds for your everyday vitality and health.

Instead of your one-sided blinkered small town approach that possibly your dominee taught you, suggest you study some... maybe take a puff or two....and pass it on?

Yes it will last forever .... that you can be sure of that.

;)

i do know the medicinal values of teh oil, tea etc.
yes it has proven to be w orth while drug in society.

but smoking weed puts you on a plak!!!!
so if you are a lorrie driver, driving 40 tons at top speeds, you not going to stop in time at teh traffic light!!!

then teh sh!t will hit the fan!!!


Total BS.... WWS....

Dr halibut hoffman
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Ja dop and dope not in the same league each other when it comes to impairing motor skills. There has been a wealth of real scientific study on this. The results has always shown something like this:

Dope= Less accidents,
Dop = More accidents,
Dop + dope = Even more accidents..

The common denominator being dop. Now WWS, how many times in your life have you driven over the limit, endangering others..and don't say you haven't because it is something WE HAVE ALL DONE. ;) But don't get offended, your input is always appreciated!
That said driving under any narcotic, myprodol included is illegal.

It is great that now it is more in the open and all the mis-information you were led to believe was true now just turns out to have been propaganda for monetary or political gain. Some of us have never believed the BS, seeing much different evidence of the truth, for ourselves decades ago.

I cured my epilepsy in the late 90's, funny I am still grand mal when hooked up to a scanner or when I look at LED's in my peripheral vision but I have not had a fit in 20 years. Of smoking. The oil gets you more goofed BTW, I prefer to smoke as it is easier to titrate my dose. I have cured skin cancer on my face, twice, once with liberal application of oil over time, the other more recent one was at my tear duct so applying oil would cause great irritation so I just smoked 150g odd of oil and watched the cancer fall off my face..

So WWS you don't have to accept zol, nor do I hope to convince you to ever get goofed..But what is F'ing great is that all the ignorant zealots out there can no longer legally have any issue with me smoking MY zol. That they have to accept.

The Dagga Party gets my vote this election!!!

Well done Jeremy Acton and Gareth Prince! More Fire!

Last edited on Mon Apr 29th, 2019 09:35 am by Dr halibut hoffman

jonathanw
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More Fire :breakd: !

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Dr halibut hoffman wrote:
Ja dop and dope not in the same league each other when it comes to impairing motor skills. There has been a wealth of real scientific study on this. The results has always shown something like this:

Dope= Less accidents,
Dop = More accidents,
Dop + dope = Even more accidents..

The common denominator being dop. Now WWS, how many times in your life have you driven over the limit, endangering others..and don't say you haven't because it is something WE HAVE ALL DONE. ;) But don't get offended, your input is always appreciated!
That said driving under any narcotic, myprodol included is illegal.

It is great that now it is more in the open and all the mis-information you were led to believe was true now just turns out to have been propaganda for monetary or political gain. Some of us have never believed the BS, seeing much different evidence of the truth, for ourselves decades ago.

I cured my epilepsy in the late 90's, funny I am still grand mal when hooked up to a scanner or when I look at LED's in my peripheral vision but I have not had a fit in 20 years. Of smoking. The oil gets you more goofed BTW, I prefer to smoke as it is easier to titrate my dose. I have cured skin cancer on my face, twice, once with liberal application of oil over time, the other more recent one was at my tear duct so applying oil would cause great irritation so I just smoked 150g odd of oil and watched the cancer fall off my face..

So WWS you don't have to accept zol, nor do I hope to convince you to ever get goofed..But what is F'ing great is that all the ignorant zealots out there can no longer legally have any issue with me smoking MY zol. That they have to accept.

The Dagga Party gets my vote this election!!!

Well done Jeremy Acton and Gareth Prince! More Fire!



LOL, well said... will still not sink in mate, you how it goes....LOL, anyway you are right on the oils, it took some of mom's as a tester, hectic...

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jonathanw wrote:
More Fire :breakd: !

to light another spliff???? LOL

Serra Moz
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I believe they had too much zol?

Attachment: MC2.jpg (Downloaded 31 times)

Serra Moz
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and then.... zol stuffs up the mind?

Attachment: MC1.jpg (Downloaded 30 times)

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Have any of you guys attempted to make your own cannabis oil. If yes, please run through your extraction method

Last edited on Mon Apr 29th, 2019 12:39 pm by MichaelK

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Serra Moz wrote:
jonathanw wrote:
More Fire :breakd: !

to light another spliff???? LOL



Yaa Man ! ;)

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MichaelK wrote:
Have any of you guys attempted to make your own cannabis oil. If yes, please run through your extraction method

Not oils personally but, I have seen on the web how they use butane gas to extract oils, seems very effective, butane gas is pumped into the cylinder containing the herb and passed through the end with a filter medium, the collective liquid is then boiled to remove the butane residue and only oil remains behind, think it would not be that hard to make the equip if you have some basic DIY skills.

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MichaelK wrote:
Have any of you guys attempted to make your own cannabis oil. If yes, please run through your extraction method


Howzit bru, not yet, but I bought for my mother, in Durbs - rather costly - there's a few legal places that you can buy from - also there's page on FB.... which I belong to, of course not just about 'smoking' but growing = making oils are more the theme. But - Dr. HALLIBUT will guide you thru the steps. I took some drops (my mother's stash) pretty strong....LOL, I am off shift now, hence the wi fi is not good or rather shite in my cabin, but I will - copy and paste the link here tonight - or add my on FB = 'De Wet BRITZ'..

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Oh yes it can be dangerous to make...... be cautious if trying...

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jonathanw wrote:
MichaelK wrote:
Have any of you guys attempted to make your own cannabis oil. If yes, please run through your extraction method

Not oils personally but, I have seen on the web how they use butane gas to extract oils, seems very effective, butane gas is pumped into the cylinder containing the herb and passed through the end with a filter medium, the collective liquid is then boiled to remove the butane residue and only oil remains behind, think it would not be that hard to make the equip if you have some basic DIY skills.


You can also check google, lots of tips / recipes - for free, but take there's been some incidents etc...

Serra Moz
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MichaelK wrote:
Have any of you guys attempted to make your own cannabis oil. If yes, please run through your extraction method

This is the SA Facebook page:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/cannaclubsa/?ref=nf_target&fref=nf

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Thanks, my wife has had 3 back operations and is in constant pain. She now lives on heavy pain killers and anti inflammatory medication. When i approached one of the suppliers in the Durban area, i was given a price of R800 per 3ml. This is obviously because all of a sudden there is a demand for this product so the suppliers or home manufacturers have drastically driven up the price.

Its legal in SA to grow the weed at home, so i'll try make the stuff myself and see if it helps with my wifes back pain.

Thanks for the help

Serra Moz
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MichaelK wrote:
Thanks, my wife has had 3 back operations and is in constant pain. She now lives on heavy pain killers and anti inflammatory medication. When i approached one of the suppliers in the Durban area, i was given a price of R800 per 3ml. This is obviously because all of a sudden there is a demand for this product so the suppliers or home manufacturers have drastically driven up the price.

Its legal in SA to grow the weed at home, so i'll try make the stuff myself and see if it helps with my wifes back pain.

Thanks for the help


It should be cheaper now, or so I've heard, since the "legal" outlook, who did you buy from?

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Mate i cant mention names, because although it may be legal to grow and use it at home. Its still illegal to sell the product.

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For that, grow yourself, and extract into olive oil (as they did it in early chapters of the BIBLE) or coconut oil (new age). A slow cooker at 100 degrees or less or a double boil will suffice and repeat with new dry weed and same oil till it is concentrated. Loosely strain each time (stainless sieve), extract and stir/agitate for an hour or less or more (but long enough) at a time and when done, filter the oil through cotton balls or coffee filters and it's good to go. Store in the fridge for longer term and keep some out for use now.. You can get that oil pretty golden and potent, just cant be smoked which is a good thing as no mates are going to raid your medicine. Rubbing this oil on pain and inflammation helps wonders, I'd say up with diclofenac preparations (voltarin) and sometimes when my back is really giving me hell I just run a hot bath with epsoms, dollop a table spoon or more of this oil in, and soak in it..THAT works wonders!

I have mates on pain management therapy in wheelchairs, for that the butane stuff was a godsend as well as the maturation of the dab technology, for the first time they can have such a large dose at once they can interrupt pain signals from phantom pain as they start. That has allowed them to go off a regimen of up to 10 different opiate courses and use maybe one when needed, dabbing the rest of the time when the pain starts. But I'm not going to tell anyone how to make butane oil, to do that you must already know what you are doing and have proper equipment and know and follow safety precautions, there are hundreds of people that have blown themselves up over the years making it. It is NOT safe to do unless you know what you are doing and follow correct procedures and take precautions etc.. and then there is the purity of solvent, getting the excess solvent out of your oil..leave that to the pros.

Last edited on Tue Apr 30th, 2019 12:08 pm by Dr halibut hoffman

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Dr halibut hoffman wrote:
For that, grow yourself, and extract into olive oil (as they did it in early chapters of the BIBLE) or coconut oil (new age). A slow cooker at 100 degrees or less or a double boil will suffice and repeat with new dry weed and same oil till it is concentrated. Loosely strain each time (stainless sieve), extract and stir/agitate for an hour or less or more (but long enough) at a time and when done, filter the oil through cotton balls or coffee filters and it's good to go. Store in the fridge for longer term and keep some out for use now.. You can get that oil pretty golden and potent, just cant be smoked which is a good thing as no mates are going to raid your medicine. Rubbing this oil on pain and inflammation helps wonders, I'd say up with diclofenac preparations (voltarin) and sometimes when my back is really giving me hell I just run a hot bath with epsoms, dollop a table spoon or more of this oil in, and soak in it..THAT works wonders!

I have mates on pain management therapy in wheelchairs, for that the butane stuff was a godsend as well as the maturation of the dab technology, for the first time they can have such a large dose at once they can interrupt pain signals from phantom pain as they start. That has allowed them to go off a regimen of up to 10 different opiate courses and use maybe one when needed, dabbing the rest of the time when the pain starts. But I'm not going to tell anyone how to make butane oil, to do that you must already know what you are doing and have proper equipment and know and follow safety precautions, there are hundreds of people that have blown themselves up over the years making it. It is NOT safe to do unless you know what you are doing and follow correct procedures and take precautions etc.. and then there is the purity of solvent, getting the excess solvent out of your oil..leave that to the pros.


@ PSY, do you think WWS will approve of this as in the above posted?

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_anointing_oil
Kaneh Bosem is accepted to most likely refer to cannabis. Jesus was the one who broke protocol and started using the oil to heal the masses. Apparently, as everything in the bible is heresay, after so many translations. Apparently he was crucified for giving cannabis oil to the masses..

""Jesus Healing the Blind"  from 12th Century Basilica Catedrale di Santa Maria Nouva di Monreale in Sicily."
The oil was supposed to be reserved for priests, funny that is what happened to most concoctions made from "sacred plants" in most cultures and religions, commoners not generally worthy of the secrets bestowed from the brews. With the royalty and religious power always being intertwined the use of these potions in in history has generally been extended to the kings and queens and their families too. Is/was this right? I agree with the Jesus character and say no. History has a way of repeating itself and here we find ourselves again, and when I got skin cancer years ago and I had lost my father and godfather to cancer before that, I thought, well, why not, if I know how to heal myself, and can, after healing a mates mom in mid 2000's...why not. Stuff the law, I knew the applied law was illegal itself already as I had been using dope under doctors instruction for ten years already for my epilepsy and it worked and that when applying my rights enshrined in the constitution, made all lower drug law redundant..law works like that. The highest law of the land even says so in plain enough english right in the beginning of the document, how everyone else missed it for 22 years blows me away! I had been trying to tell people this for 20 years. I was just laughed at, hahaha. Brainwashing is a powerful force haha.

My neurosurgeon told me in late 90's, that if it works, and is safe, then who has the right to tell you not too. And since I smoked already, the epilems were not needed, just to smoke before water sports so he could have a clear conscience that I would not drown. It is basically almost impossible to have a fit with your blood flooded with cannabanoids as your body uses its' own cannabanoids to stop fits and moderate them.
In fact I now believe that in someone like me, grand mal, that my endogenous cannabanoid system is naturally weak and it NEEDS supplementation for me to function properly. I later thought about it and realized no one has the right to tell me what to put into my body, safe or unsafe. Same like they cannot tell me what to do with my body, if my actions do not affect you, you cannot act in a manner that affects me. Specifically that, was Jesus' entire pluk for crying out loud, that in fact was his ONLY commandment he gave to humans, according to that book, it is not a new concept!! I've eaten of the priestly concoctions from religions from every corner of this globe.. I can understand fully why they were reserved for the class of people in power, the truth sets you free and the last thing the people in power want is for the masses to be free! Hence the books full of lies, and world of lies, and ignorant leaders, and ignorant masses that we sit with today.. ;) The cultures where they were NOT reserved for the elite but shared with the masses, those ARE the few different, sustainable and peaceful cultures you find on the planet today still. It is very polarized and the common denominator is...these plants/fungi and whether the use has been preserved and shared, or kept for the elite and forgotten.

On another note..Shrooms will too soon be legal for personal use (not that they are actually illegal now, if one applies the law fully). Ever see any of the original surviving artworks and documents and scrolls from the christian "cults" that pre-dated the evil catholic church <200-300AD and also in later art. Most of these surviving earliest christian documents are kept safe by the ethiopian coptic church in their library in their highlands. The history of christianity in ethiopia is fascinating, that is how far the early christians had to flee to under roman and later catholic (roman) persecution. Strange how almost every page or painting in the entire collection of almost 2000 year old art, is adorned with little blue and gold leaf mushrooms?! Think about that..Mana..Gimme more! Eat enough mana and you too will feel like Jesus..Happened to Timothy Leary and many many many more before and after..haha history repeats itself..but now I am waaaaay off topic, but it is the lounge! We talk about fishing in the lounge of cannabis forums and the likes hahaha.



Always blue and gold in coptic architecture and art...hmmm royal blue? Queens' Blue..Imperial Blue..Blue blood..whats that all about? Whats up with the holymen all having that golden halo? Hehe. Anyways..leave the masses to figure it out LOL.

Shakespeare also liked his cannabis, a researcher from Wits I think did that academic work?..It has been proven, yup there was weed in his pipe, among others.

Last edited on Wed May 1st, 2019 09:07 am by Dr halibut hoffman

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A entertaining watch..;) Charlize and Seth Rogan have fun with a lie detector..The truth can be really funny!

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Some classic quotes to end off my input here ;) RIP Bill..

“I think it's interesting the two drugs that are legal, alcohol and cigarettes, two drugs that do absolutely nothing for you at all, are legal, and the drugs that might open your mind up to realize how badly you're being fucked every day of your life? Those drugs are against the law. He-heh, coincidence?
I'm glad mushrooms are against the law, because I took them one time, and you know what happened to me? I laid in a field of green grass for four hours going, "My God! I love everything." Yeah, now if that isn't a hazard to our country … how are we gonna justify arms dealing when we realize that we're all one?” ― Bill Hicks

“You see, I think drugs have done some good things for us. I really do. And if you don't believe drugs have done good things for us, do me a favor. Go home tonight. Take all your albums, all your tapes and all your CDs and burn them. 'Cause you know what, the musicians that made all that great music that's enhanced your lives throughout the years were rrreal fucking high on drugs. The Beatles were so fucking high they let Ringo sing a few tunes.”
― Bill Hicks

Add a swathe of literature including pretty much all religious texts, through the ages to that burn!
“They lie about marijuana. Tell you pot-smoking makes you unmotivated. Lie! When you're high, you can do everything you normally do just as well — you just realize that it's not worth the fucking effort. There is a difference.”
― Bill Hicks
“Why is marijuana against the law? It grows naturally upon our planet. Doesn’t the idea of making nature against the law seem to you a bit . . . unnatural?”
― Bill Hicks

“Always that same LSD story, you've all seen it. 'Young man on acid, thought he could fly, jumped out of a building. What a tragedy.' What a dick! Fuck him, he’s an idiot. If he thought he could fly, why didn’t he take off on the ground first? Check it out. You don’t see ducks lined up to catch elevators to fly south—they fly from the ground, ya moron, quit ruining it for everybody. He’s a moron, he’s dead—good, we lost a moron, fuckin’ celebrate. Wow, I just felt the world get lighter. We lost a moron! I don’t mean to sound cold, or cruel, or vicious, but I am, so that’s the way it comes out. Professional help is being sought.Wouldn't you like to see a positive LSD story on the news? To base your decision on information rather than scare tactics and superstition? Perhaps? Wouldn't that be interesting? Just for once?
Today a young man on acid realized that all matter is merely energy condensed to a slow vibration, that we are all one consciousness experiencing itself subjectively, there is no such thing as death, life is only a dream, and we are the imagination of ourselves. Heres Tom with the Weather.”
― Bill Hicks

“I smoke. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your fuckin' mouth.”
― Bill Hicks
“I know this is not a very popular idea. You don't hear it too often any more … but it's the truth. I have taken drugs before and … I had a real good time. Sorry. Didn't murder anybody, didn't rape anybody, didn't rob anybody, didn't beat anybody, didn't lose – hmm – one fucking job, laughed my ass off, and went about my day. Sorry. Now, where's my commercial?”
― Bill Hicks

“There are essentially only two drugs that Western civilization tolerates: Caffeine from Monday to Friday to energize you enough to make you a productive member of society, and alcohol from Friday to Monday to keep you too stupid to figure out the prison that you are living in.”
― Bill Hicks
“Here is my final point...About drugs, about alcohol, about pornography...What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, or take into my body as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet? And for those who are having a little moral dilemma in your head about how to answer that question, I'll answer it for you. NONE of your fucking business. Take that to the bank, cash it, and go fucking on a vacation out of my life.”
― Bill Hicks

Just go fish..:)

Last edited on Wed May 1st, 2019 10:26 am by Dr halibut hoffman